Agreed, that's the point of bitcoin, so we can say f-off if we don't agree with what they think.

Its democracy, not dictatorship on how this shit is.

Yes.

From what i've read, what your saying is that 0.8.2. is going to not allow micro transactions? What defines a micro transaction?
Bitcoin was designed to be divisible by 8 decimal places, If we are removing some of those decimals we are undermining the entire structure of bitcoin!

I can fully understand and agree that a transaction of .00000001 should be blocked though

You mean who?  Gavin.  Gavin now decides how we spend our Bitcoins.

Op make a poll!

You can very easily resist this. That's what this topic is all about. Simply refuse to "upgrade" to 0.8.2.

It's not a protocol rule and miners are free to include transactions with outputs smaller. The change causes miners not include transactions with outputs which are a small fraction of the fee amount they have configured to treat as zero for the purpose of priority. They can change the setting and the network doesn't mind. It's a default, not a rule.

This is expected to reduce the problem of people creating data storage transactions which are uneconomical (or impossible) to redeem, but shouldn't effect actual financial transactions (even if the value of Bitcoin goes through the roof— as people will adjust the fee-treated-as-zero as that happens, and the defaults will be updated as time goes on, the network isn't require to be consistent as— again— it's not a protocol rule).

IIRC, Satoshi himself put in the first rule against very small transactions— making the node behavior to only mine or relay if a fee of 0.01 or greater was provided for transactions without any outputs smaller than 0.01 in order to stop dust flooding attacks. Because fees of 0.01 became rather large they were subsequently lowered to 0.0005 and now 0.0001 but a single fee is being abused to cram many megabytes of child porn website directories and other such junk in unspendable txoutputs. Requiring larger outputs is hopefully less intrusive than requiring the same value as a larger fee.

they are being payed to fuck up the chain and bitcoin

Yes in particular people putting data onto the blockchain encoded as transactions: https://bt.irlbtc.com/view/191039.0

There isn't any way to block that yet other than making it more expensive.

Unless the blockchain size is truly unlimited, which is impossible, someone is always going to get their transactions blocked.

The demand side of supply and demand for blockchain space is unlimited. You can always use it to timestamp data at least, so why not timestamp everything you can get your hands on if transactions are really cheap?

We need to find a balance between cheap transactions and decentralization. I believe 1MB is fine for the forseeable future, but other people think differently.

Thats not correct. This isn't a protocol rule. As miners shift down the fee value they consider to be 0 for priority purposes it shifts this threshold down too.

The word censorship loses meaning if you erroneously apply it to everything you don't like.

People can create txoutputs which cost more in fees to spend than they provide in bitcoins. This results in an increase in the perpetual unprunable data and the working set size of full nodes, and people use these outputs to also force all bitcoin users to carry around non-bitcoin data.  Making the default behavior to not mine the creation of new outputs that can't be economically spent directly addresses the issue of outputs which are uneconomical to spend.

People are demanding that the fees be _decreased_ while the non-bitcoin junk data storage is _increasing_ under the current fees.  This is the same general mechanism and it's also adjustable.

What the change does is makes it so that you can't pay a single 0.0001 fee and create a ton of 0.00000001 outputs.  The base fee was 0.0005btc/KB in 0.8.1 and 0.8.2 _lowers_ the base fee to 0.0001BTC/kb but refuses to mine transactions which create outputs which are so small that they'd be uneconomical to spend considering the miner's configured minimum-fee-to-not-treat-as-zero.


Uh. You are so thoroughly confused I don't know where to start.

(1) The change doesn't block anything.  Your "CENSORSHIP" here is crying wolf. It changes the default mining behavior to not include some transactions which are very likely to be abusive non-financial transactions, but it's just a default and its adjustable. It doesn't make them not able to be included. You've been told this multiple times. You've acknowledged that you understand that it's a configurable default, so are you intentionally telling lies now?

(2) There are VERY many transaction kinds which are inhibited in exactly the same way— in fact, unlike this most of them can't be permitted without modifying the source code. (Search for 'bitcoin standard transactions')