DaRude
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June 05, 2022, 04:46:52 AM
Last edit: June 05, 2022, 05:00:17 AM by DaRude |
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Russia recognized DNR and LNR as independent states, rest of the world did not, so all of accusations of stealing stem from that. Following that logic you might as well claim that they used "stolen" port and stole ships in Crimea for transport. Since Crimea is in a similar state of world recognition
That's absurd. The commodities being stolen don't belong to the state, be it Ukraine, DNR/LNR, or Russia. Does the "recognition" now imply forced nationalization of all private property? BTW grain is being looted in Kherson region and other areas not part of DNR/LNR. And of course the "liberators" try to steal money as well, because why not: In Melitopol, during an inventory of the premises of banking institutions, hryvnias of various denominations spoiled by employees of Ukrainian banks were found, RIA Novosti correspondent reports.
... except the video shows what looks like IBNS theft protection dye. But that's not stealing because DNR/LNR amirite. If they don't belong to the state, why is the state the one complaining? Shouldn't it be some company stating that it lost so many tons of grain? The HIMARS are on the way. Don't worry, brothers. The first four are already in Europe, and they are meant for training purposes. Later, when our soldiers will learn to operate HIMARS, we'll be receiving dozens of them until the invaders will run off of our land. There's no two ways about it. It's important for the whole world to see that an attempt to change the government of another sovereign country by force fails.
The Javelins didn't help, the Bayraktars didn't help, the M777s didn't help, but multiple launch rocket systems will definitely help. A good plan, as reliable as a Swiss watch. Actually they did help. Russians were pushed out and weren't able to take Kiev. At this point the more Russians die in this war the better for Ukrainians and the numbers keep growing. If a weapon can add to that number it's always good to have it. This is a good piece. Check it out if you haven't seen it yet. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIZIspwem2sI was amazed how young squad commanders are. This guy was a total newbie and apparently finished one of the best military schools in Russia. His superior's vehicle was hit and he didn't know what to do, what date it is, how to proceed. -shit they are shooting at us -shoot them -the gun is stuck -let's run away and hide Javelins and bayraktars are a waste of money here. These guys just want to get drunk and sleep in a warm bed. It could be better for US but i fail to see how that's better for Ukraine? Every day hundreds of Ukrainian soldiers die and more land is lost, i don't see how that can be better for Ukraine? Minsk agreements (guaranteed by Germany and France) called for autonomy for LPR and DPR, now Russia controls that plus majority of Kherson and Zaporizhzhia. Kharkiv, Dnipropetrovsk, Mykolaiv and Odessa also seem to be on the Russian radar. Whatever happens, happens for the best only works for propaganda. Oh they took Kherson and Zaporizhzhia? Well we still won, and loosing thousands lives was worth it cause we saved Dnipr and Odessa. Oh they took Dnipr and Odessa, well see still worth it because we saved Kyiv. Oh they took Kyiv well we still won and sacrificing our army was worth it because we saved Poland? EU? cause surely they would've been next and we caused so many casualties to Russia  Western allies meeting regularly to game out potential framework for Ukraine ceasefire as war hits 100th day US officials have in recent weeks been meeting regularly with their British and European counterparts to discuss potential frameworks for a ceasefire and for ending the war through a negotiated settlement...Ukraine is not directly involved in those discussions, despite the US commitment to "nothing about Ukraine without Ukraine." Even CNN sentiment and coverage appears to be changing, realpolitiks Russia broke all Minsk agreements with Ukraine on Feb 24, 2022. When dealing with Russia, the "guarantees on paper" are worth less than the paper they are written on. The West needs to understand that this conflict needs to be resolved militarily not only in Ukraine. As long as the Russian regime is not defeated, this aggression will continue in other countries. Russian military needs to be defeated, Moscow needs to be captured, and all Russian nuclear weapons need to be disarmed and deactivated. True statement, but did Ukraine abide by the Minsk agreements from 2014 until 2022? This is a very scary proposition, to a point where i'm not even sure who's side you're on anymore. Saying that every Ukrainian should fight until Moscow is captured, is setting unattainable goals in which you needlessly doom a lot of Ukrainians to their death. Literally being set up for failure with almost religious undertones as if they're fighting for something greater than all of them, fighting for all of Europe/humanity/free world/galaxy/universe. If Ukrainians are so eager to lay their lives for someone else's war, how about setting them to fight China till the last Ukrainian while we're at it? I'm sure the free world would gladly donate as many weapons as Ukraine can handle. How is any of that is good for Ukrainians?? Of course, they did. It was Russia that vetoed UN proposals to bring peacekeepers into the Donetsk and Luhansk regions. Russia broke the agreements as soon as they were signed by introducing its military to the Ukrainian territory. Russia is a terrorist state. No one should be doing any business with them, never mind signing any political agreements. Only a total demilitarization of Russia and a breakup into independent democratic states will bring peace to this world. Imperialist Russia will ALWAYS be an existential threat to humanity. - Immediate and full ceasefire in particular districts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts of Ukraine and its strict fulfilment as of 00:00 midnight EET on 15 February 2015.
- Pull-out of all heavy weapons by both sides to equal distance with the aim of creation of a security zone on minimum 50 kilometres (31 mi) apart for artillery of 100mm calibre or more, and a security zone of 70 kilometres (43 mi) for multiple rocket launchers (MRLS) and 140 kilometres (87 mi) for MLRS Tornado-S, Uragan, Smerch, and Tochka U tactical missile systems:
- for Ukrainian troops, from actual line of contact;
- for armed formations of particular districts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts of Ukraine, from the contact line in accordance with the Minsk Memorandum as of 19 September 2014
The pullout of the above-mentioned heavy weapons must start no later than the second day after the start of the ceasefire and finish within 14 days.
This process will be assisted by OSCE with the support of the Trilateral Contact Group.
- Effective monitoring and verification of ceasefire regime and pullout of heavy weapons by OSCE will be provided from the first day of pullout, using all necessary technical means such as satellites, drones, radio-location systems etc.
- On the first day after the pullout a dialogue is to start on modalities of conducting local elections in accordance with the Ukrainian legislation and the Law of Ukraine "On temporary Order of Local Self-Governance in Particular Districts of Donetsk and Luhansk Oblasts," and also about the future of these districts based on the above-mentioned law.
Without delays, but no later than 30 days from the date of signing of this document, a resolution has to be approved by the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine, indicating the territory which falls under the special regime in accordance with the law "On temporary Order of Local Self-Governance in Particular Districts of Donetsk and Luhansk Oblasts," based in the line set up by the Minsk Memorandum as of 19 September 2014. - Provide pardon and amnesty by way of enacting a law that forbids persecution and punishment of persons in relation to events that took place in particular districts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts of Ukraine.
- Provide release and exchange of all hostages and illegally held persons, based on the principle of "all for all". This process has to end at the latest on the fifth day after the pullout (of weapons).
- Provide safe access, delivery, storage and distribution of humanitarian aid to the needy, based on an international mechanism.
- Define the modalities of a full restoration of social and economic connections, including social transfers, such as payments of pensions and other payments (income and revenue, timely payment of communal bills, restoration of tax payments within the framework of Ukrainian legal field).
With this aim, Ukraine will restore management over the segment of its banking system in the districts affected by the conflict, and possibly, an international mechanism will be established to ease such transactions. - Restore control of the state border to the Ukrainian government in the whole conflict zone, which has to start on the first day after the local election and end after the full political regulation (local elections in particular districts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts based on the law of Ukraine and Constitutional reform) by the end of 2015, on the condition of fulfilment of Point 11 in consultations and in agreement with representatives of particular districts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts within the framework of the Trilateral Contact Group.
- Pullout of all foreign armed formations, military equipment, and also mercenaries from the territory of Ukraine under OSCE supervision. Disarmament of all illegal groups.
- Constitutional reform in Ukraine, with a new constitution to come into effect by the end of 2015, the key element of which is decentralisation (taking into account peculiarities of particular districts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts, agreed with representatives of these districts), and also approval of permanent legislation on the special status of particular districts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts in accordance with the measures spelt out in the attached footnote,[note 1] by the end of 2015.
- Based on the Law of Ukraine "On temporary Order of Local Self-Governance in Particular Districts of Donetsk and Luhansk Oblasts", questions related to local elections will be discussed and agreed upon with representatives of particular districts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts in the framework of the Trilateral Contact Group. Elections will be held in accordance with relevant OSCE standards and monitored by OSCE/ODIHR.
- Intensify the work of the Trilateral Contact Group including through the establishment of working groups on the implementation of relevant aspects of the Minsk agreements. They will reflect the composition of the Trilateral Contact Group.
Can you point me to how the above highlighted points from Minsk 2 were implemented by Ukraine? Read this fucking thing again. "Pullout of all foreign armed formations, military equipment, and also mercenaries from the territory of Ukraine under OSCE supervision. Disarmament of all illegal groups."This point was not fulfilled by Russia. It was impossible to accomplish anything else with Russia. They vetoed all UN resolutions to bring peace to this region. I am even surprised they "agreed" to this point when they knew they never planned to fulfill it. But that is what Russians do, think one thing, say something else, and do something else altogether. Not only that, they brought more military and FSB personnel after they signed this agreement. This conflict was orchestrated by Russia. Both FSB and military were involved first in Crimea and immediately afterward in Donbas when FSB terrorists captured the Sloviansk police station. The rest is history. The Minsk 'agreements' were signed to buy Russia time to ferment more 'pro-Russian' sympathy in Donbas, but when this did not work, we got the Feb 24th invasion as Putin was fed up with Russian speaking Ukrainians. Thank you for acknowledging that Ukraine didn't implement those two points. Words have meanings, you should look up differences between "impossible" and "undesirable"! 1) "did Ukraine abide by the Minsk agreements from 2014 until 2022?" -> "Of course, they did."2) "This point was not fulfilled by Russia. It was impossible to accomplish anything else with Russia."
That is objectively called lying! You're not going to raise any support by lying! You can't expect anyone with half a brain to fall for such cheap trick! You can finger point all day long, explain how they weren't fair, or provide reasons why Ukraine didn't implementing Minsk agreements by blaming DPR/LPR not implementing other points first, that's all fine, but what you cannot do is fool people by saying that Ukraine implemented Minsk agreements. That's just a lie, you ruin any credibility you've had by claiming such nonsense, and trying to make idiots out of the readers! |
