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    Author Topic: "Bitcoin is Speculation & Gambling" - Warren Buffett Critisize  (Read 368 times)

    • LDL (OP)
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    April 14, 2023, 09:26:09 PM
     #1


    https://twitter.com/SquawkCNBC/status/1646135432982286338?s=19

    According to Warren Buffett, Bitcoin is called a gambling coin because it does not have a fixed value. Warren Buffett cares more about paper money or fiat than Bitcoin, but one thing is very important that Warren Buffett cares about the dollar in this satirical/Critisized  interview.

    But in a tweet replay to Bitcoin Magazine, a gentleman gave a strong response to his satirical interview, which is brought to you all.

    Quote from: https://twitter.com/civic_cat/status/1646933596266168320?s=19
    Dear Mr. Buffett,

    I realised recently money is just intermediate value.

    It is value that hasn’t assumed the form of something we can directly use.

    So the value of a dollar is not $1–that would be circular.

    It is what you can exchange that dollar for. The seller determines this.

    Yet if the value of a dollar ever felt immutable, unchangeable, it was due to a web of implicit trust between buyers, sellers, and institutions.

    Institutions willing to enforce its value with might and steel.

    So the dollar, the most commonly traded instrument in history, never had intrinsic value.

    It had exchange value derived from trust and force.

    Banks safekeep and bookkeep money. They are exchange hubs.

    Their ledgers are codices of exchanges. Of transaction history.

    They also make money by issuing loans, but this third function relies on the first two.

    Money first roamed the world as cowrie shells, gold and silver, then cash.

    It roams bankspace through SWIFT, ACH, whatever networks banks run in the backroom, maybe FedNow in the future.

    Bankspace has become a superfluous middle step because we can now network directly with each other.

    Cash has become problematic because so much of it has been issued.

    Because so much of it has been issued, a lot of it is being spent, in turn driving prices up and lowering that exchange value of a dollar.

    Bitcoin is just money on a blockchain

    A blockchain is a peer-to-peer exchange network that bypasses bankspace.

    As a networked ledger duplicated across multiple nodes, it addresses the need for safekeeping and bookkeeping.

    Bitcoin’s like money.

    Because it is value in intermediate form, and tradeable for dollars.

    Like euros or yen or renminbi.

    And its value is ultimately decided by its buyers and sellers, just like money.

    And if people counterfeited or issued more Bitcoin, its value would drop in response.

    But it was born to have a fixed supply, unlike money.

    So it’s not a gambling token.

    It has characteristics as a network of value exchange that make it a more stable type of money.

    A money native to this reality where mobile devices are ubiquitous.

    Tweet reply from: https://twitter.com/civic_cat/status/1646933596266168320?s=19

    How would you respond to Warren Buffett's anti-Bitcoin comments?

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    April 14, 2023, 09:30:21 PM
     #2
    Warren Buffett Blasts Bitcoin as 'Gambling Token' as BTC Surges 35% in 30 Days
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    April 14, 2023, 09:36:24 PM
     #3
    Quote from: LDL on April 14, 2023, 09:26:09 PM
    How would you respond to Warren Buffett's anti-Bitcoin comments?
    We have known Warren Buffett to be a bitcoin critic, it is no more new, but bitcoin price has increased significantly since I have known that Warren Buffett is a bitcoin critic. I knew about bitcoin when its price was $7000 to $8000. I knew Buffet to be bitcoin critic at the time too, but bitcoin adoption is reality.

    Warren Buffett is getting old, he believes in what he does when he was young and successful.
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    April 14, 2023, 09:44:02 PM
     #4
    Quote from: LDL on April 14, 2023, 09:26:09 PM
    How would you respond to Warren Buffett's anti-Bitcoin comments?
    I wouldn't. Anti Bitcoin comments are sometimes best ignored as long as they are not spreading malicious wrong information, like in the case of CSW.

    Warren Buffet has for a long time been anti Bitcoin publicly, it's no surprise he still finds a way to drop a comment or two on Bitcoin even if that is not directly related to the question asked. It's a sort of obsession many typical wealthy people have, they are surprised the network has not collapsed yet as they predicted.

    If I'm for formulate a reply; I would talk about how he tries to instill confidence in bank depositors, that their investment are always safe there and he does not see a system that operates on whims to be unsustainable. And I would ask that he doesn't use Bitcoin to make his interviews more popular.
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    April 14, 2023, 09:57:16 PM
     #5
    Quote from: LDL on April 14, 2023, 09:26:09 PM
    How would you respond to Warren Buffett's anti-Bitcoin comments?
    I would not convince flies to believe that flowers are more beautiful than mud. But some explanation of the myth must be answered with this one. So don't convince Warren Buffett about bitcoin, it's useless.

    Bitcoin has no intrinsic value (unlike some other things)

    Quote
    Bitcoin has no intrinsic value (unlike some other things)
    This is simply not true. Each bitcoin gives the holder the ability to embed a large number of short in-transaction messages in a globally distributed and timestamped permanent data store, namely the bitcoin blockchain. There is no other similar datastore which is so widely distributed. There is a tradeoff between the exact number of messages and how quickly they can be embedded. But as of December 2013, it's fair to say that one bitcoin allows around 1000 such messages to be embedded, each within about 10 minutes of being sent, since a fee of 0.001 BTC is enough to get transactions confirmed quickly. This message embedding certainly has intrinsic value since it can be used to prove ownership of a document at a certain time, by including a one-way hash of that document in a transaction. Considering that electronic notarization services charge something like $10/document, this would give an intrinsic value of around $10,000 per bitcoin.

    While some other tangible commodities do have intrinsic value, that value is generally much less than its trading price. Consider for example that gold, if it were not used as an inflation-proof store of value, but rather only for its industrial uses, would certainly not be worth what it is today, since the industrial requirements for gold are far smaller than the available supply thereof.

    In any event, while historically intrinsic value, as well as other attributes like divisibility, fungibility, scarcity, durability, helped establish certain commodities as mediums of exchange, it is certainly not a prerequisite. While bitcoins are accused of lacking 'intrinsic value' in this sense, they make up for it in spades by possessing the other qualities necessary to make it a good medium of exchange, equal to or better than commodity money.

    Another way to think about this is to consider the value of bitcoin the global network, rather than each bitcoin in isolation. The value of an individual telephone is derived from the network it is connected to. If there was no phone network, a telephone would be useless. Similarly the value of an individual bitcoin derives from the global network of bitcoin-enabled merchants, exchanges, wallets, etc... Just like a phone is necessary to transmit vocal information through the network, a bitcoin is necessary to transmit economic information through the network.

    Value is ultimately determined by what people are willing to trade for - by supply and demand.
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  • Dr.Bitcoin_Strange
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    April 14, 2023, 09:58:52 PM
     #6
    Quote from: SatoPrincess on April 14, 2023, 09:30:21 PM
    Warren Buffett Blasts Bitcoin as 'Gambling Token' as BTC Surges 35% in 30 Days

    OP, these same thread have been created before yours, a person of your caliber should know how to use the forum search to check if topic you want to create has already been created to avoid committing spam.
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    April 14, 2023, 10:04:02 PM
     #7
    One thing I know about rich people is that they aren’t going to give you financial advice for free. Warren Buffet has always been a strong critic of bitcoin and I don’t think he’s going to stop now. Buffet is old, talking about bitcoin keeps him relevant amongst young people. This interview was to reassure Americans that the banks are still a safe place to keep your money. I think he’s sentimental about the issue but let’s look at the historical data of bitcoin before making their decision.

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    April 14, 2023, 10:10:48 PM
     #8
    It is very obvious that Warren Buffett is Ann who does not like Bitcoin at all and he likes talking againat Bitcoin telong people not to see reason of investing in it. Everyone has opinion to say what ever they think or like about Bitcoin that is why I am not bothered to see that buffet does not like Bitcoin at all, including his entire family.
     I think they just need to back off from this claim of Bitcoin not having an intrinsic value to people. There are people who had been rich just by holding Bitcoin so his claim does not have a logical facts.

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    April 14, 2023, 10:43:28 PM
     #9
    Quote from: Bushdark on April 14, 2023, 10:10:48 PM
    It is very obvious that Warren Buffett is Ann who does not like Bitcoin at all and he likes talking againat Bitcoin telong people not to see reason of investing in it. Everyone has opinion to say what ever they think or like about Bitcoin that is why I am not bothered to see that buffet does not like Bitcoin at all, including his entire family.
     I think they just need to back off from this claim of Bitcoin not having an intrinsic value to people. There are people who had been rich just by holding Bitcoin so his claim does not have a logical facts.
    Yes, this is a free market on which everyone could really be able to give out and share their own opinions which we know that it cant be wrong nor it cant be right.Its not really that shocking that

    there would be those people who would really be that bearish when it comes to Bitcoin or someone who do really loves to criticize which is mostly into those people who are really that billionaires out of those traditional investments that we do know and heavily relying and depending on banking system which it isnt really that shocking that they would really be having that kind of
    feedbacks and opinions but its not something that we should be minding off specially for us who do support Bitcoin mainly.

  • franky1
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    April 15, 2023, 03:35:08 AM
    Last edit: April 15, 2023, 03:46:49 AM by franky1
     #10
    a $10 bank note has a underlying value of the cost to print a bank note (paper+ink ($0.14)) its then the laws of utility (tax/min wage/debt/fines) that then speculate above that to give it values(emotional/functional utility/desire) thus giving it a price of $10 or 7 loaves of bread

    its numeric value is so low because someone somewhere on the planet can get it for that low amount. so thats its underlying intrinsic value

    bitcoin has a underlying value of the cost of mining. cheapest on planet being ~$18k/btc this year, $15k in 2022. then its the rules of code that give it values(emotional/functional utility/desire) which then speculate such utility/desire to give it a price above value

    its numeric value is so low because someone somewhere on the planet can get it for that low amount. so thats its underlying intrinsic value

    speculation and PRICE variety, are things ABOVE value.. price is not value

    US bank note value $0.14..  price $10.. speculation 7142.86%
    Gold value $1k..  price $2k.. speculation 200%
    bitcoin value $18k..  price $31k.. speculation 172%

    a $10 bank note in 2012 bought 10 loaves of bread
    a 1btc($10 price) in 2012 bought 10 loaves of bread


    a $10 bank note in 2023 buys 7 loaves of bread
    a 1btc($31k price) in 2023 buys 21800 loaves of bread
    I DO NOT TRADE OR ACT AS ESCROW ON THIS FORUM EVER.
    Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both researched opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at

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    April 15, 2023, 03:42:27 AM
     #11
    Quote from: Upgrade00 on April 14, 2023, 09:44:02 PM
    Warren Buffet has for a long time been anti Bitcoin publicly, it's no surprise he still finds a way to drop a comment or two on Bitcoin even if that is not directly related to the question asked. It's a sort of obsession many typical wealthy people have, they are surprised the network has not collapsed yet as they predicted.

    If I were to guess — 90% of the time it's the journalists asking him about Bitcoin hence his comments (Bitcoin-related hate gets a lot of shares). In this case though, it kinda fits towards the topic — which is gambling, so it's not like he just randomly mentions Bitcoin willy-nilly.

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    April 15, 2023, 04:00:19 AM
     #12
    Warren Buffet did not like Tech companies and he publicly said about that many decades ago. Recent years, Berkshire Hathaway invested into Apple which shows that Warren is a person who can change his mind if he finds good reasons for it.

    I am not shocked if Warren and Berkshire Hathaway invest in to Bitcoin and cryptocurrency in future. If they can invest in Apple, they can invest in cryptocurrency. If they do that, Bitcoin will surely be their first choice. With their big capital, they will want to choose a cryptocurrency that is safest, with least risk and has big trading volume enough for them to enter and exit with their big capital without waiting many days or weeks to complete their deal.

    Warren and Berkshire Hathaway don't have to directly invest in Bitcoin but can invest in companies that mine Bitcoin or invest in Bitcoin like Micro Strategy.
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  • ilovealtcoins
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    April 15, 2023, 04:10:20 AM
     #13
    Quote from: Pokapoka124 on April 14, 2023, 10:04:02 PM
    One thing I know about rich people is that they aren’t going to give you financial advice for free. Warren Buffet has always been a strong critic of bitcoin and I don’t think he’s going to stop now. Buffet is old, talking about bitcoin keeps him relevant amongst young people. This interview was to reassure Americans that the banks are still a safe place to keep your money. I think he’s sentimental about the issue but let’s look at the historical data of bitcoin before making their decision.

    And the rich don't want others to become as rich as they are, so it's understandable that they speak ill of an asset that can make someone else rich quickly. If it were me, I would do the same, I don't want everyone to be rich because then the world will be unstable. Most of us are speculating on bitcoin, hoping to get rich quickly, so I have a feeling what he's saying is talking about us, not bitcoin.

  • Gallar
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    April 15, 2023, 04:25:38 AM
     #14
    Quote from: LDL on April 14, 2023, 09:26:09 PM
    How would you respond to Warren Buffett's anti-Bitcoin comments?
    Quote
    In the company's annual general meeting of shareholders, Saturday (30/4/2022) United States time, Buffett said that bitcoin is not a productive asset and does not produce anything real.
    What does bitcoin mean that it doesn't produce anything real, what do you mean real results?, even though if you think about it deeper, bitcoin always produces something real, with the results obtained from bitcoin, it can be made into something real. So what is meant by not producing something real, what does that mean, it's clear that bitcoin is real, and something real, will definitely produce something real.
    and about unproductive bitcoin, that's also a big mistake, because so far bitcoin has always been an investment asset that continues to be productive.

    Buffet doesn't seem to really fully understand bitcoin, because the opinion expressed by Warren Buffet looks like random speech, without being based on specific research. So I don't really care about what comes out of his mouth, because people's opinions are always different, so if Waren Buffett doesn't like bitcoin, go ahead, I don't think about it too much, and it won't make me switch from bitcoin.
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  • Weawant
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    April 15, 2023, 07:26:40 AM
    Merited by CryptSafe (4), Rruchi man (3), Sandra_hakeem (3)
     #15
    Quote from: LDL on April 14, 2023, 09:26:09 PM
    How would you respond to Warren Buffett's anti-Bitcoin comments?

    Buy more Bitcoin. Buying more Bitcoin each time this negative comments are made towards Bitcoin is the best respond and then keep on holding until those bitcoin are worth more in the future before selling.

    Warren Buffett doesn't like Bitcoin and he has been making that clear from the first time he was interview on Bitcoin. I remember some public figure in the Bitcoin community requested to take him to dinner to explain what Bitcoin was and I think he declined.

    Warren Buffett still believe in the traditional way of investing that has to do with investing in things like stock real estate. He has a hard time believing in new technology as well so him criticizing Bitcoin isn't a new habit of his.

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    April 15, 2023, 07:42:47 AM
     #16
    Another old man yells at cloud once again, nothing new here. We don't care about what he says anyway, Bitcoin wasn't meant for him in the first place I think.

  • Fiatless
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    April 15, 2023, 08:26:13 AM
     #17
    Quote from: ilovealtcoins on April 15, 2023, 04:10:20 AM
    Quote from: Pokapoka124 on April 14, 2023, 10:04:02 PM
    One thing I know about rich people is that they aren’t going to give you financial advice for free. Warren Buffet has always been a strong critic of bitcoin and I don’t think he’s going to stop now. Buffet is old, talking about bitcoin keeps him relevant amongst young people. This interview was to reassure Americans that the banks are still a safe place to keep your money. I think he’s sentimental about the issue but let’s look at the historical data of bitcoin before making their decision.

    And the rich don't want others to become as rich as they are, so it's understandable that they speak ill of an asset that can make someone else rich quickly. If it were me, I would do the same, I don't want everyone to be rich because then the world will be unstable. Most of us are speculating on bitcoin, hoping to get rich quickly, so I have a feeling what he's saying is talking about us, not bitcoin.
    If cash has intrinsic value why we're people carrying cash in wheelbarrows to buy basic needs in Zimbabwe and Somaliland? The value of any currency is its worth in the market. How much goods it can buy is the value of any currency. As much as I know, holding or using any currency is a risk because none has a constant value.

    And it is important to note that anything can be used as money and it will have value. If people in my country refuse to use the national currency as a medium of exchange and decide that human hair is now the means of exchange, human hair will immediately start having value. If people decide to use Bitcoin, its value will also go high and the government can do nothing about it. If the government decides to give its citizens freedom to choose the currency they want to transact with, many will choose Bitcoin and the government knows that's why they are using force to enforce compliance to their bad policies.
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    April 15, 2023, 08:57:59 AM
     #18
    Warren Buffet is a sentimental person,he keeps on with his critics on bitcoin, but still bitcoin has proven him wrong ever he became an anti-bitcoin agent. It is such people that goes around spreading the FUD and deceiving those that don't have the knowledge of how bitcoin works,that fiat currency is more valued to bitcoin and safer. I am happy that this year USD depreciated due to high rate of inflation, and some banks also collapse. All these incidents have proved him wrong about his hate on bitcoin and praises of fiat and banks. It is clear that he is talking from an arcade mentality because with the recent catastrophe faced by the economy, some investors are adopting bitcoin to secure the value of their funds.
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  • fuguebtc
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    April 15, 2023, 09:18:10 AM
     #19
    Quote from: LDL on April 14, 2023, 09:26:09 PM


    How would you respond to Warren Buffett's anti-Bitcoin comments?

    Honestly, I hope what he says and what he does will be the same. I mean, I'm afraid he's always saying negative things about bitcoin but behind our back, he's buying cheap bitcoins, and one day, when bitcoin hits $1 million, he says he holds thousands of bitcoins. Don't believe what rich people say because they just want the rich world only themselves, and they don't want too many rich people.

    He can say anything about bitcoin, but as long as he doesn't buy bitcoin, I will always support him. Bitcoin should not fall into the hands of these rich people because they will get richer and richer, and the world will be more divided.
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    April 15, 2023, 10:14:43 AM
     #20
    I hope that newbies will not take Buffett's criticism towards Bitcoin as a way for them not to approach Bitcoin, and still give themselves some time to learn it.

    I mean we've heard numerous criticism towards Bitcoin. Since I started way back 5 years ago in learning Bitcoin, I've already heard some bad news on it. In 2017, back when I was a newbie still I've heard that China is banning ICO's, and at that time its hype is at its highest. Of course it affected Bitcoin, but not on the way that most people expected. Instead of it going down, it went up even though there are many negative news at that time. Over the years, there are many negative news, negative criticism that has been said towards Bitcoin, but look where it is now. Many people are still interested in investing into it, and it's kind of ironic that he said negative things about it, but the price went up after he said it.

    Warren Buffett is one of the most popular investors in the world, and I'm following his footsteps with regards to investing into stock market, but I will not follow what he's saying with regards to crypto, and I'd rather ignore it.
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