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    Author Topic: What about the lost BTC?  (Read 1796 times)

    • Zigabel
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    February 14, 2024, 12:38:50 PM
     #41
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.

    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.

    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.

    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?
    Creating new BTC to replace that which were lost at some point due to certain things is not going to be really healthy for the currency, because it may cause some chaos as you did mentioned because even that which is currently available is about to be reached like you said so trying to bring back thst which was lost can cause some kind of chaos both on the block chain and transections, it may aswell affect the price of Bitcoin, currently Bitcoin is about to experience halving and this alone will help with reducing the number of available Bitcoin so being the lost ones back is just more or less chaotic.
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  • roller33 (OP)
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    February 14, 2024, 12:47:54 PM
     #42
    Quote from: lombok on February 12, 2024, 04:39:39 PM
    Quote from: PrivacyG on February 12, 2024, 04:32:41 PM
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.
    How do you determine which Coins are lost and which are not?

    I have Addresses I have not used in MANY years.  I likely have a few Private Keys or Seeds hidden somewhere in the middle of some random note book.  These Coins are not lost.

    Think about it.  Some body may have died a decade ago with a Seed hidden between two pages of a book.  Their relatives may decide to read that book in 2050.  Would that be lost Coins?

    There are dormant Addresses since 2010 and the likes which have moved recently.  This is why we rather call it DORMANT Addresses and not Lost.

    And then it does not make any sense.  Why would there be a compensation for the lost Bitcoin.  With Bitcoin you are responsible for your own actions.  You decided to not take care of the Bitcoin?  It is what it is.  The Coins are lost.  Move on.  I bet there are many who do not even remember they ever had Bitcoin back in 2009 on their computer.  Their Hard Disk is laying somewhere in the middle of a giant pile of trash and will probably never be retrieved ever.

    Why would Miners earn more Bitcoin and why would we all have more Inflation for others mistake.

    Lost Coins are just never going to be moved.  That is all.

    It's true that in my opinion Bitcoins are simply not or have not been accessed again by their owners. Bitcoin holders or owners who lose their phrase actually only lose the private key used to access Bitcoin. Losing the private key does not mean losing Bitcoin. Bitcoins will remain in the wallet forever and cannot be taken by anyone or even lost.

    Maybe the owner just forgot or hasn't found the private key yet.

    Well, if you have a money that is locked forever, even if you know that it is there, but it can't be used or moved, than it can be considered lost, can't it? hahaha
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  • m2017
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    February 14, 2024, 01:10:06 PM
     #43
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.
    "Not your keys - not your coins."

    All those who lost bitcoins should have carefully monitored their safety.

    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.
    It would be interesting to know about your method for counting lost bitcoins. What data did you use to guide your analysis?

    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?
    For compensation go to the bank. Although they are reluctant to return any compensation.

    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.
    What is lost, let it remain lost from now on and forever and ever.

    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?
    This will lead to a depreciation of the current bitcoins. Additional emissions will lead to cheaper prices. The value of bitcoin is in its limitations.
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  • retreat
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    February 14, 2024, 01:17:45 PM
     #44
    As far as I know, this topic has been discussed before by the members. And the answer to this is impossible. We cannot compensate for this by adding a supply of 5 million bitcoins to the Bitcoin hard code, because that would compromise the integrity of Bitcoin. Just let those millions of Bitcoins sit in those abandoned wallets because it's none of our business to be able to take care of that.
    R


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  • Natsuu
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    February 14, 2024, 01:23:22 PM
     #45
    If we can and we start adding more because some got lost, it messes with the scarcity that makes Bitcoin attractive. Plus figuring out who gets compensated and how could turn into a huge headache, causing drama in the crypto world. It's like trying to fix one problem but creating a bunch of new ones

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    February 14, 2024, 01:36:23 PM
     #46
    Quote from: Natsuu on February 14, 2024, 01:23:22 PM
    If we can and we start adding more because some got lost, it messes with the scarcity that makes Bitcoin attractive. Plus figuring out who gets compensated and how could turn into a huge headache, causing drama in the crypto world. It's like trying to fix one problem but creating a bunch of new ones
    It will be a loop that scares many investors.

    Because if we can add more bitcoins, just say, to fill what were lost. We can do the same but to increase Bitcoin total supply to any number we want, and the new added supply can exceed what were lost.

    Like we have 5M lost bitcoins, we can create 5M bitcoin to fill what were lost. Later we can create 5M or 10M or 21M more bitcoins, to do whatever we want and no longer care about lost bitcoins.

  • DubemIfedigbo001
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    February 14, 2024, 02:06:11 PM
    Merited by JayJuanGee (1)
     #47
    Quote from: _act_ on February 12, 2024, 12:11:28 PM
    No, lost bitcoin are gone forever. If you want to recover any lost bitcoin, try all possible way to recover back the private key or the seed phrase.
    I've heard sometimes ago of one site managed by a father and son CryptoAssetRecovery.com that promises to try recovering crypto wallets if you've your encrypted private keys and somehow forgot the password to the wallet, or a damaged hard drive containing the private keys. The chances are very limited though, but its worth the try depending on how much assets you've in the wallet.
    But I'll advise that you're very careful of the services you're hiring and do your researches properly, so you don't get scammed in the process and your coins lost.

    Quote from: _act_ on February 12, 2024, 12:11:28 PM
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.
    Just like what centralized ripple (XRP) developers wants to do. It is not making any sense. Private key or seed phrase are used to prove the ownership of an address and that is also needed to spend the coins, which is enough.
    That's absolutely nonsense, what if the owners of those coins finds a way of retrieving it in the future, then there will be more supply than the standard figure. That suggests non-authenticity of the coin. Those lost coins should remain that way, so that bitcoin will continue to be limited in supply and as simple economics tells us. "Decrease in supply will in turn cause an increase in demand"
    This leads to the value of the commodity increasing and I think this is an added advantage for bitcoin.
     
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    February 14, 2024, 02:24:55 PM
    Merited by JayJuanGee (1)
     #48
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.

    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.
    There is no method of returning lost bitcoins caused by carelessness and loss of the wallet seed phrase that we have will be completely lost. That's why we need to consider the level of security and we have to store the seed phrase well so as not to lose the bitcoin assets we own. In the past, people might not have cared about security because the price of Bitcoin was not that valuable, but nowadays, almost many people's main priority is just security and taking good care of the seed phrase generated from their wallet.

    What is lost remains lost forever when the Seed phrase is the problem and there is no way to recover bitcoin assets if that is the case. Therefore, special attention must be paid to security issues before everything is lost and what people feel is a lesson so that we can be more careful.

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    February 14, 2024, 03:14:11 PM
     #49
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.

    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.

    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.

    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?



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  • serjent05
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    February 14, 2024, 03:58:03 PM
     #50
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:19:05 PM

    Quote
    Compensation, like, how? Do you mean rewarding those who have lost their bitcoin or adding those back to the supply?

    I mean adding it back to the supply to be available for mining again.

    Would not this increase the maximum supply of Bitcoin?  Aside from that, implementing this thing will bring chaos to the system.  It might unintentionally bring back the idle Bitcoin that is not lost but are just sitting on the address for hodling sake.  If the implementation is erasing the lost Bitcoin and bringing it back for mining, it is more disastrous because as I stated, accidentally deleting Bitcoin that is not lost will cause a huge loss to the owners.

    Just leave Bitcoin as is, let the Bitcoin that can't be accessed be keep out of the market circulation.  It will bring rarity and increase the value of the coins.  Besides there is plenty of satoshi to trade with even if people market has no access to half of the Bitcoin supply.

    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:19:05 PM
    Giving it back to the owners would be impossible, or if possible, it would be ridiculous, as each owner should take care of their BTC.

    Bitcoin is not designed to be centralized and that is one of the big factors why Bitcoin is the King of cryptocurrency.

  • HelliumZ
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    February 14, 2024, 04:06:38 PM
     #51
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.

    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.

    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.

    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?

    Bitcoin wallets that lose their security systems will lose their Bitcoins forever, never to be recovered. So the lost bitcoins will be subtracted from the total supply, making a quarter of the total supply of bitcoins considered as lost bitcoins. All these lost bitcoins will become completely zero value with no chance of ever adding to the total supply.










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  • kryptqnick
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    February 14, 2024, 05:03:47 PM
     #52
    There are no accurate estimates of how much BTC is actually lost vs how much is just inactive because the owners don't want to move it anywhere. Assuming that BTC is lost if it wasn't moved over several years (and that's exactly what some estimates do) isn't really fair. Maybe someone lost a password, but can accidentally find it in the future. Maybe someone has access to coins but is such a hodler that enjoys keeping the funds in an unmoving state.
    There will be no compensation for the lost coins (and I am sorry for people who lost their coins), but there's also no need for that because Bitcoin is divisible into satoshis.
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  • Lukmanfirdaus1
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    February 14, 2024, 05:59:34 PM
     #53
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.
    their biggest mistake, why do that lol. It should have been recorded, printed, laminated and put in a safe, so that something like this wouldn't happen, but never mind, it's gone, right?

    Quote
    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.
    That's good, I think this is good news, there are 5 million BTC that are being burned independently, so the price can be controlled, I can't imagine if that 5 million BTC enters the market, how bad the BTC market will be. but the 5 million is already in hell, so it's okay.

    Quote
    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?
    what kind of compensation? I don't think there is any way to recover it, it will be lost forever, or maybe later it can be unlocked with a super quantum computer or something, but now the only way is to know the phrase.
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  • AndrewWeb
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    February 14, 2024, 07:09:34 PM
     #54
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.

    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.

    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.

    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?
    Well since "Satoshi Nakamoto" has 1 million of does 5 million BTC you would have to ask him. That is, if he has kept the 20 thousand privatekeys to the 1 million BTC ?

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    February 14, 2024, 07:35:28 PM
     #55
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.

    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.

    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.

    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?


    That is not possible. Those Bitcoins will be lost forever and will never be moved unless those users have a miracle and get access again with their wallets. When you say compensation for those lost BTC, do you mean they will get a replacement or the missing Bitcoins will be added again to the circulating supply?
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  • seoincorporation
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    February 14, 2024, 07:52:15 PM
     #56
    Quote from: LesterD on February 14, 2024, 07:35:28 PM
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.

    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.

    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.

    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?


    That is not possible. Those Bitcoins will be lost forever and will never be moved unless those users have a miracle and get access again with their wallets. When you say compensation for those lost BTC, do you mean they will get a replacement or the missing Bitcoins will be added again to the circulating supply?

    Lost bitcoins can be recovered if someone finds the address's private key, is hard to find those keys, but is possible that someone will do so in the future. But is important to remember Satoshi's words about this topic:

    Lost coins only make everyone else's worth slightly more. Think of it as a donation to everyone

    So, lost coins isn't bad at all for the network.

  • Nothingtodo
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    February 14, 2024, 07:58:55 PM
     #57
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    I was reading about some cases of people who had many BTC at a time when it has low or no value at all, and didn't care about it, so they eventually lost their security phrases, or hard wallets and now it is lost probably forever.

    I've read that the amount that is considered lost can be up to 5 million BTC. That is about 1/4 of the total amount available.

    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.

    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?
    Bitcoins are generally considered lost for life if they are lost or a device's system crashes, or if a major Bitcoin investor dies without having any information available, the Bitcoins cannot be recovered for some reason. In this case, those bitcoins that can never be recovered are called inactive wallets without knowing the details about the bitcoin or the bitcoin address.assumed as According to various statistics, a quarter of the total Bitcoin supply from the number of wallets is assumed to be inactive Bitcoin. If these bitcoins become active in the future, they will be added to the total supply, and if they are no longer active, then these bitcoins will be discarded as lost forever.
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  • Franctoshi
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    February 14, 2024, 08:22:23 PM
     #58
    Quote from: roller33 on February 12, 2024, 12:07:20 PM
    Knowing that BTC has a limit, and we're getting there soon, isn't it possible to have some compensation for those lost BTC?

    Something like adding more BTC in an equivalent amount for those lost BTC, or something similar.

    Would it be positive for the currency or could bring some caos?
    Only 21 million Bitcoin can ever exist, meaning you cannot print more than 21 million Bitcoin, any BTC lost as result of misplacing your private keys/key phrases can never be recovered, However instead of we to have 21 million Bitcoin total in circulation we would rather have less than that, maybe something around 19-20 million, and furthermore this lost Bitcoin has even helped reduce the number of Bitcoin that should have been in circulation.
     
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  • AmoreJaz
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    February 14, 2024, 09:02:28 PM
     #59
    Quote from: Franctoshi on February 14, 2024, 08:22:23 PM
    Only 21 million Bitcoin can ever exist, meaning you cannot print more than 21 million Bitcoin, any BTC lost as result of misplacing your private keys/key phrases can never be recovered, However instead of we to have 21 million Bitcoin total in circulation we would rather have less than that, maybe something around 19-20 million, and furthermore this lost Bitcoin has even helped reduce the number of Bitcoin that should have been in circulation.

    as the supply of btc is fixed, there's nothing we can do anymore with the lost btc. just accept the fact that it will not be recovered and come back to its circulation. and i believe, the number is further increasing, as there are holders that are also forgetting or somewhat losing their access to their wallets.

    the reduction of its number will further aid in the market price increase considering the supply and demand concept. if the demand will increase and with fixed supply, definitely we are heading to the positive direction of this market.
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  • JayTrain
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    February 14, 2024, 10:04:09 PM
     #60
    I understand that compensating for lost BTC may seem like an attractive idea, especially considering potential losses. However, personally, I fear that adding additional coins into circulation to compensate for lost BTC could lead to inflation and undermine trust in the currency. Such intervention could also undermine the core principles and uniqueness of BTC as a limited and decentralized asset.
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