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Topic: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them. (Read 893 times)

Alpha Marine (OP)

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They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 01:11:51 PM

I've been hearing a lot about Trump and other world leaders, big corporations, and countries and how they can impact Bitcoin and make it grow. While I agree that these people can impact Bitcoin, Bitcoin does not revolve around them.

Bitcoin has grown so much without a federal reserve from the US or China. In less than 15 years bitcoin got a market cap of over $1 trillion without having presidents pushing for it or a leading economy having a bitcoin reserve, so why does it now seem like without these people or these things bitcoin can't get bigger than it is currently? Bitcoin got to this level in a time when there were so many regulations and scepticism, a time when some people made it their side hustle to make sure they shit on bitcoin, despite all these, bitcoin soared.

The point I'm trying to make is that Bitcoin will keep growing and getting bigger without reserves so we shouldn't see these things or people as the authors and finishers of bitcoin. Don't get me wrong, I'm fully aware of the significance of a bitcoin reserve in the US, but bitcoin doesn't need a reserve to succeed. It simply needs the market to keep trusting in it. Even with a reserve and people don't trust it, it will be worthless.
The reason for the talk of reserves and the reason for big corporations getting into bitcoin is to make a profit, which means they need bitcoin to make a profit, but bitcoin doesn't need them to grow and that's why I said they need bitcoin more than bitcoin needs them.

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Stablexcoin

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 01:23:42 PM

Big companies and the political leaders adapting Bitcoin can only influence the price in a short while but they are not the reason why Bitcoin exist in the first place and how it has thrive to this extent. They are getting into Bitcoin to get a slice of the cake they have missed or neglected in the early beginning. The rejected stone has not become the Chief corner stone now everyone wants it, including those with powers has brought down their ego to embrace it. Bitcoin doesnt need them, but they need Bitcoin to stay relevant and successful in the new financial world.

Woe to those who still think that because Trump and some big companies are embracing Bitcoin, that's what will make it succeed.

OcTradism

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 01:36:45 PM

Quote from: Alpha Marine on February 17, 2025, 01:11:51 PM

Bitcoin is not dead and it won't be dead in future in my opinion.

In past years especially earliest years since 2009, Bitcoin was more sensitive to be dead but now in 2025, we all know that Bitcoin is not dead. Moving toward future, it's very likely Bitcoin won't be dead.

Expectations changed very fast, from Bitcoin trades for something (pizza for example), to centralized exchanges, Bitcoin futures in 2017 with CME and CBOE, and Bitcoin Futures ETFs, Bitcoin Spot ETFs. But now it's not enough and people want to have Bitcoin national reserves. Without it, will Bitcoin be dead?
No.

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Ziskinberg

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 01:58:10 PM

I think we have no choice, we still need them. Because if they say we don't need them, what if a big country like the US adopts the same stance as China and makes Bitcoin trading illegal? That would really put us in a tough spot. I believe we have to accept that the key to widespread Bitcoin adoption is friendly regulation among major countries. So, we need the US and other big countries to be positive about Bitcoin, ensuring its adoption continues to grow.

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Frankolala

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 02:32:55 PM

The glorious victory of bitcoin over its haters and inflation have made those who were against it come back for it. They see that they don't have any options than to join the bitcoin moving train or miss out. Of course, bitcoin doesn't need anyone to grow, and bitcoin has proven that several times in the past. What spike up the price of bitcoin is the demand, and that's why you see that people are looking up to government. If they start buying, it will make bitcoin price skyrocket since they're big whales who are only stacking.

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Zaguru12

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 02:49:39 PM

Quote from: Ziskinberg on February 17, 2025, 01:58:10 PM

Once again this is where most people actually get it wrong when there is a statement about bitcoin having the capacity to stand out on his own. Bitcoin is decentralized we know but that doesnt mean government policies wouldnt have impact on it, but as such without them it will still stand. Some of the government policies we have actually been talking about that will affect bitcoin is maybe it been banned by top countries like the USA this can cause FUD and as such result in the price dump as many of other countrys citizen wouldnt want to get into trouble with the government also it could reduce the adoption rate coming from there just like what happened during The Chinese ban but would it stop its growth? No it wouldnt even if it will be slower with the bans.

Same thing is what will happen should the government turns towards bitcoin for reserve storage or even by relaxing the restrictions placed on it, policies like this will simply just cause many people to embrace bitcoin more and this in turn increases the adoption rate and increases the price of bitcoin, just like we saw with the ETF approval.

But would the government turning away from bitcoin now actually make it die? I think you know the answer is No because bitcoin has grown so well even the FUD was high during its early years so right now where the adoption is almost global and the importance is there for all to see it wouldnt be much of a thing without the government support.

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ImThour

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 02:55:10 PM

Trump's main focus was on Bitcoin and Cryptocurrency in general this elections and that was because the previous government was somewhat against the proposals.
So he basically took everything which previous government was against and accepted those, indirectly adding more voters to his vote bank.

very smart move and it surely does help the Bitcoin as well because US is the biggest economy in the world and any reforms taken by Trump are monitored by other countries as well.

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dzungmobile

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 02:58:42 PM

Quote from: Zaguru12 on February 17, 2025, 02:49:39 PM

Governments can do things they want under constitutions in their countries and yes, they can ban Bitcoin in their countries but the fact is they can not control what happen in other nations.

China ban Bitcoin, China crack down Bitcoin mining, in short term, it's bad for Bitcoin miners in China but they can do migration to other countries. Same with other bans against Bitcoin in other nations, and fortunately Bitcoin network is decentralized so that one or some governments can not kill Bitcoin.

They can make impacts on Bitcoin market with their policies but if there is no global universal agreement among all nations and governments to ban Bitcoin, Bitcoin will keep crawling and become stronger with time.

Liliana1304

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 03:11:56 PM

Quote from: Ziskinberg on February 17, 2025, 01:58:10 PM

The Op accepted that these countries can make an impact and make impact but that doesn't mean they should get carried away by feeling that the growth of Bitcoin revolves around them. The other day I read about senator Lummis was talking about how the economy of the US could grow exponentially if they began looking into building a Bitcoin reserve which means she has acknowledged the important role Bitcoin plays.
So what if the US imposes strict rules on Bitcoin? Assuming such a thing happens, bitcoiners would still find a way to thrive.

You're making it look like a decentralized currency like Bitcoin needs the government to survive. If that is the case, the essence of Satoshi creating it to be free of such dependence would then be lost.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 03:18:55 PM

#10

Quote from: Alpha Marine on February 17, 2025, 01:11:51 PM

Totally agree

Bitcoin has seen many developments, many types of adoptions from various areas including
small countries ^{El Salvador}, Institutional investment interests with the many
Spot ETF's in the US but in the mean time the dynamics of Bitcoin remain the same.

Developers keep developing
Miners keep mining
Nodes keep being hosted

These for me are the triad of essential Bitcoin health Bitcoins journey.

Quote from: Zaguru12 on February 17, 2025, 02:49:39 PM

Quote from: Ziskinberg on February 17, 2025, 01:58:10 PM

Once again this is where most people actually get it wrong when there is a statement about bitcoin having the capacity to stand out on his own. Bitcoin is decentralized we know but that doesnt mean government policies

But would the government turning away from bitcoin now actually make it die? I think you know the answer is No because bitcoin has grown so well even the FUD was high during its early years so right now where the adoption is almost global and the importance is there for all to see it wouldnt be much of a thing without the government support.

No

News like Trump becoming "interested" in Bitcoin really gets a lot of attention and some people
believe Bitcoin can only continue to exist with interest from the likes of ETF's and National
Reserves and such like but again Bitcoin's journey will continue without them.

Not everyone is convinces that ETF's and National Reserves are that essential for Bitcoins continued
existence or its future.

Sure there are plenty who really advocate for it but thats IMO more about making profit.

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dzungmobile

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 03:32:31 PM

#11

Quote from: Liliana1304 on February 17, 2025, 03:11:56 PM

So what if the US imposes strict rules on Bitcoin? Assuming such a thing happens, bitcoiners would still find a way to thrive.

If Bitcoin miners could successfully migrate from China to other nations around and very far like the USA, they can do the same if the USA cracks down Bitcoin mining for example.

Regarding to the USA, they have been becoming more friendly with Bitcoin and we have Bitcoin Spot ETF approvals in January 2024. Bitcoin adoption trend is up and it is shown with a massive Bitcoin Spot ETF approval wave in the nation, and globally more countries are following the Bitcoin adoption trend. I can be too optimistic about Bitcoin future but I see Bitcoin adoption trend is upward and irreverisble like how Bitcoin transactions are irreverisble and Bitcoin blockchain can not be rolled back like Ethereum blockchain.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 03:35:11 PM

#12

Indeed, Bitcoin has never needed a central figure of power to succeed. However, do you know who is guilty for putting Bitcoin on this shameful condition?

The adopters and investors themselves, who started idolizing figures like Musk and Trump, as if Bitcoin needed them to hit a new ATH and to go to the moon.

These people completely subverted the purpose of Bitcoin and its decentralized nature in order to adulate politicians and billionaires who don't care at all about Bitcoin, neither about their fans.

Now it's already done, and that kind of opinion is the most popular one. The tendency is that Bitcoin is going to be manipulated even more by such personalities in the following years.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 03:57:15 PM

#13

It's a mutualistic relationship, both of them help each other.

If the US declared if they ban Bitcoin, I quite doubt Bitcoin can be like this big, because many countries follow what the US did. Which mean, it might make half of countries in the world to ban Bitcoin.

We can do peer to peer trade, but in practice it's really hard to do when we still use banks.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 05:06:59 PM

#14

Quote from: Alpha Marine on February 17, 2025, 01:11:51 PM

I dont know where you hear such information, afaik, Trump has held lots of press conferences and none of the Journalists have ever asked him questions regarding his intention on Bitcoin. They're still working on the mistakes of the last administration, maybe after that the president would move ahead to matters on Bitcoin and cryptocurrency. I've not seen or heard of world leaders discussing Bitcoin, they've been holding meetings on peace and ceasefires. As for your information, Japan invested $1trillion in the USA to fund quantum computing.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 05:45:00 PM

#15

Quote from: Accardo on February 17, 2025, 05:06:59 PM

Quote from: Alpha Marine on February 17, 2025, 01:11:51 PM

As politicians assume offices most especially the changes in party there will be a lot of issues that require urgent national attention and that the first few days in office will be faced with alot of workload for them, and for that focus on matters of external influence such as Bitcoin will be seen as advanced and carefully looked at things and they don't need to rush into things as not to make mistakes along the line, this is the main reasons why even though Trump made cryptocurrency the center of his campaigns he is yet to make any open statements regarding that, and the whole world is waiting for when that will happen and what the impact will be on the general cryptocurrency market.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 06:26:15 PM

#16

They all need each other, not just one way. Institutional investors need Bitcoin to make a profit from it. The US government, or whichever government wants to use it as a strategic reserve, also needs Bitcoin so that they can make a profit from it for the US and also to show their support and holding power over every other government.

For Bitcoin, when the government holds large quantities of Bitcoin aside from price surges, we are rest assured that there will be less strict policies against Bitcoin; they can't stand against it. What they are holding can no longer be considered an illegal currency used for illicit activities; they cannot just wake up and ban it, placing some kind of sanction on lawbreakers.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 07:26:00 PM

#17

If i can't disagree with you mean i have to accept judging from one perspective, both factors are necessary to one another. After last halving took place, Trump was a factor that help extended the growth of Bitcoin, among everything that pioneered we can't deny the huge influence played by the US election. Aside the influence of Trump, Bitcoin wasn't created to be dependent on any alternative source, as long the market experience purchasing power continuously following the different pattern of the market, the price will always make new highs on it's own. Trump reserves are to help them selves for the long run but the influence of Trump on the market will only last for a while and someday we will experience the DIP again, so Trump should have the better side of the benefits if they should keep to plan.

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cr1776

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 07:29:25 PM

#18

Like a network effect, the more people that use bitcoin whether it be to protect their assets, commerce or as a reserve etc, the better for the entire ecosystem. Does bitcoin *need* any one or group to succeed? No, but the more the merrier.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 08:22:18 PM

#19

Well, when it comes to consistency of bitcoin price growth, bitcoin may not need them since it can grow on its own as long as there is good supply and high demand. However, since we are aiming for bitcoin global adoption, which will only be possible if majority of the countries, especially the major countries, will get align to bitcoin. So they are still crucial to bitcoin, although bitcoins long-term survival wont definitely rely on these big names or big countries.

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Re: They need Bitcoin more than Bitcoin needs them.

February 17, 2025, 08:28:03 PM

#20

We needed the Trump pump tbh and good for us we got it. Before Trump got elected bitcoin was around 60-70k if I remember right. As we got closer to the election day price began to climb and eventually it went above $100k. Lots of people doubled or even tripled their live savings thanks to Mr President.

Bitcoin would still survive under Biden but we wouldnt get that price action which we had under Trump. I am grateful that people in the US made the right choice.

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