Maybe, maybe not. But it shouldn't matter where your money came from. Let me put it this way: if you know your tx came from a certain website, you know something about a few other addresses too. And if you know that, someone else can know something about your address.

I like what ChipMixer has to say on this:

Taint is like religion: it only exists if you want it to.

So they're arresting people now for creating open source software?

ChipMixer doesn't use vanity addresses.

That's DarkStar_'s address, not ChipMixer's.
It's not as if Signature Campaign addresses aren't public anyway.

That address gets funded from the same chips ChipMixer uses for any withdrawal. There is no "other wallet".

You can even make your own chips:
So nobody can ever be sure whether or not inputs came from ChipMixer.

wasabi wallet as windfury knows been hit recently by certain regulations. and anyone using wasabi wallet is definitely going on a watch list.

why is it the same group of a dozen people* are stupidly advertising things that will get people put on watchlists just for using certain services no matter if their coins were good or bad to begin with.

using something that is guaranteed to put you on a watch list is not "privacy"

doomad, windfury, loycev, blackhatcoiner, notatether, n0nce, o_e_l_e_o, pooya87, lucius, tadamichi and a few others

again it doesnt matter what you bought. what the coins were used for pre mixing.
again it doesnt matter if fresh minted coins were put into a mixer

by the very fact that you received coins from a mixer. whether dirty, clean or fresh mined.. by just using a mixer, your now on a watch list.

yep using a mixer hoping to hide, gets you noticed more and added to a surveillance list

and no the solution is not to use several mixers back to back hoping that regulated services give up watching.
and no trying to get everyone to use a mixer doestn not make regulated services stop watching
it just means more people/addresses/coins are added to the watch list.

thus you end up doing the opposite of hiding

here is a hint. without the silly groups wishful daydream. but actual factual information from regulators
https://bt.irlbtc.com/view/5409206.msg60729993#msg60729993
(it pays to do your research rather than trust certain people with malicious motives

I never advertised for a mixer, im talking about the taint that centralized services are introducing and that we shouldn’t accept it no matter what, this is bigger than just mixers. Because in my opinion best practice for a currency is no taint, no matter what.

It’s always brought up what criminals are using(who are a minority), so let’s ban mixers, shun everyone who uses it and not accept their coins anymore, then what? Criminals just use another platform and we just lost a piece of freedom again and are forced to be controlled harder again. In our fight in "saving the world", we should maybe once think about how these measures actually affect us. It’s weird that the proposed solution to every problem is always the same, less privacy, less freedom, more controls.

We’re becoming completely transparent and have to justify every single step we’re making, are forced to share sensitive data to companies, to just use the simplest services. The only barrier they still have are some data protection policies, but if you’ve ever looked behind the curtain and seen how employees/ companies actually handle it, i wouldn’t put too much weight on it. So stop acting like regulation equals real practice, execution is a whole other topic. If mixers put people on watchlists this easily, then people should be warned beforehand and then they can still decide for themselves. But let’s not act like we’re not already, just because a spaghetti law promises so.

The threat isn’t knowing what people bought, this information will be revealed in most online transactions anyways. It’s also not that interesting, except for advertisers. The threat is about the state knowing individuals complete financial flows and preventing certain demographics from having their money accepted on services/ making it easier to unjustly seize things when this information is completely transparent. The actual problem is linking sensitive data to it, making it mandatory on most services and the introduction of blacklists. Its not Bitcoins fault, but if no one pushes against it, then how will we know it won’t happen? It’s a social issue, not a technical one. It seems like governments are unwilling to accept no taint tho.

I get this viewpoint, but we also need to use these services less. And like i said above the real threat is what i described above, which you couldn’t just escape by flying under the radar.

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Im aware of that, i just don’t get how they’re so compliant without ever contesting anything in court. It’s about profits and not Bitcoin for them.

If what you’re saying is true, then how would you achieve privacy tho? The only way is to stop using centralized services, but how realistic is it that most people will follow? I also don’t get your problem about self-hosted LN, it’s more reliable/ usable than doing offchain transactions on paper.

How ik the people here they never just argued in sake of profits, but it was actual arguments related to real problems.

They don’t need that many employees to do it anymore, data science will suffice for any nefarious scenario there is. Especially if sensitive data is linked to an open ledger that can’t be manipulated easily.

oh oeleo

please take the conspiracy hat off and instead do some actual research
you sound like badecker

its got nothing to do with 'if you do nothing wrong you got nothing to hide' its about not sounding like a conspiracy nut who shouts fantasies and fears. and instead actually doing research to know what your targets are targetting to know how to not be in their crosshairs. using actual research not the hopes that some buddy of yours tells you is a solution. when your buddy is actually promoting you to use a service that puts a target on you


the blockchain does not reveal your purchases.. SERVICES DO
it does not matter what you bought. because the blockchain does not reveal what you bought.
its the services you have to point your finger at. and be wary of.

you seem very very obsessed in getting people to use mixers. and LN when its been shown to you that those things WILL put you on a watch list no matter what you bought

and instead you want to play scare tactic games that everyone is on a watch list and mixers take you off those lists
you really have things the wrong way around not everyone is on a watchlist. infact 0.1% are on a watch list. and guess the main reasons they are on a watch list

did you even do the research that services like kraken, bitpay and coinbase combined have about 200million customer accounts. yet in 2021 those services only filed 200k SAR's
yep of those services, they actually filed SARS  0.1% of their customers

so stop playing the false fear games that everyone is being watched by government when the actual stats (simple google search) shows only 0.1% are being watched

then go research(although i already linked you several times) what actually triggers people being red flagged as being suspicious.. and thus watched

and its not "just using bitcoin" thats a red flag.. its actually using AEC's mixers timbers and altnets that promote privacy

so understand what actually does get people put on active surveillance monitoring. and what ones just dont, and just get to use bitcoin and services without investigations and information sharing

read some regulations, businesses policies, and actually LEARN
in all your posts in the last week about privacy you have not once actually linked some actual statistic, any regulation or any policy.. but you have instead shouting out conspiracy nut scare tactics in the same manner that backecker would

so take some time. stop acting like badecker.. and use some common sense and logic instead of conspiracy fantasy

if you actually research how the real world works. then you can learn how to protect yourself better.

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again do some research

you have repeated this sentiment multiple times
"Far better to simply let the government keep a close eye on every transaction you make, everything you buy, every satoshi you purchase or earn, every website you visit, every email you send, every phone call you make, everywhere you go, everything you do, everything you say, everything you think"

can you even count
there are 320million people in america
how long do you think it takes for 4800 employees at the SEC to watch everything of everyone all the time

yep you start to realise that logic, math, physics, common sense shows that they cant and dont watch everyone
reality hits you in the face when you actually use logic and run the numbers

again they are only interested in the suspicious activities becasue they have limited people to watch suspicious activity.
thus they are not proactively watching everyone, they are reactively watching those who are on a SAR that they receive
and again when you research what criteria is set to trigger a SAR you start to learn how to stay outside that criteria, this you wont appear on a list the government watches

..
then run the numbers again
coinbase has about 60m customers and 3700 employees
do the math how much time is needed for each employee to watch, and keep an eye on all users all the time,

you start to realise they cant.
instead coinbase only looks at the customers they get red flagged

..
so instead of using badeckers conspiracy nut tone of shouting out governmetn watches everything

use actual logic, stats, data, and laws. and actually see how the real world works. then you can find the loop holes to escape being highlighted by a service thus avoid being highlighted by the government

and if you really do hate coinbase kraken bitpay and chainanalysis. then stop kissing the ass of them (yes you idolise employees of DCG)

use your buddy connections to contact your idols at DCG and go scream to them about their tactics of how they are ruining things

well 99.9% of people dont want to do shady crap. so no thanks i wont take you up on your offer to actively do shady crap, and you should not be telling normal people to do shady crap to play into your games.. but nice try to make users be red flagged.

and dont forget that if you use coinbase and then a mixer. your already red flagged before you then send another stash received from a mixer to your shady darknet sites.

so you are missing the point. you getting red flagged before you even get to buy your shady crap just by using a mixer hoping a mixer will hide you from getting noticed

it doesnt matter if its fiat or bitcoin. result would be the same. its not a fault of bitcoin. its the services.

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oh and if the darknet site is able to be found.. guess what. then that is yet another failed SERVICE
thus you again have not done your research to protect yourself
if a darknet service is using a well known wallet and re-using addresses, or using known deposit/withdrawal patterns to be recognised as something that would put someone on a watch list. thats the fault of the SERVICE

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i know how desperate you are to defend the services while trying to accuse bitcoin of being broke/not fit for purpose, thus requiring more services.. but that is your malicious profiteering greedy mindset working.. not the logic and comon sense of trying to help the community

i know you are upset that i am yet again calling out your groups crappy plot. but if you had any actual intelligence you would be able to do the research and understand what happens in reality. rather than shout out your hopes, dream and utopian idealogy of how you think things work

now go try and read some regulations and privacy policies and how services gather and share information. then you will learn where to find the loopholes of the policies, to stay off their radar

in short when a regulation and a exchange policy both say that using a mixer will get your account investigated as suspicious.. guess what.. then dont use a mixer. find a new way to avoid being red flagged

only use things that dont re-use address that dont ask for specific allotments of deposits. that dont do withdrawals at known timesets after a deposit. .. basically use things that are more random

NSA. OMG you really are sounding like badecker.
you do know that exchanges send files to the SEC not the NSA
if the SEC then want to pass info to the NSA thats another task after the SEC gets info.. you know logic of how time moves in one direction where the sec has to receive info to then pass it on..
so if the SEC only receives 0.1% then they only have 0.1% to then pass on..

you probably are well experienced of things like the 'chainletter' scam where people receive a letter and told to pass it onto 5 people and receive $x for doing so..
if people simple dont send the letter then other people dont receive it..
meaning if SEC dont get a SAR then they cant send what they dont have to the NSA
its called physics. logic. reality

you forget how the real world works. governments dont have the labour/resources to actively watch everyone. they are only interested in the suspicious events. because if they spend their limited resources on the suspicious events instead of the 1000x of data of everyone. they save themselves 1000x of time
again common sense and logic


coinbase do not watch everything. they get data from chainanalysis
chain analysis watch all the mixer know transactions and report that to coinbase

i know you have a wall of text phobia.. maybe thats why you never read things beyond the tweets and DM's of social media
but please do try to do the research
then sit back have some time to let actual research soak into your brain and then use reality, common sense, logic .. and not your conspiracy fantasy you read from someone else in your social group.

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smart people probably can think of a solution/loop hole to regulation
EG if regulations dont like mixers. the certain services can easily stop describing themselves as a mixer and instead change just a few minimal user experiences while they wait between the deposit and withdrawal to feel like the service is something else.. but the end result is.. the coins at withdrawal is different then what were deposited

EG
knowing mixers waste peoples time for about an hour of waiting..

they could stop being a "mixer"
and instead be a "game"
where people deposit funds. and a webgame appears on their screen that by doing a deposit allows them to play a game for an hour. and at the end they get their value back out. where it just happens that the value out is from a different taint
(much like how custodian wallets like exchanges do things)
ofcourse not be classed as a custodian/exchange as other rules apply. but if your smart enough to read the regulations. you can then think of the loop holes of a different category of service thats not a red flag. and not advertised as a service thats on the red flag list. but just happens to give a similar result as what people are looking for.
EG by giving out same value as what went in, its not 'gambling' thus doesnt fit gambling restrictions

now go do some research, then step away from the computer and let the information soak in and use some logic and common sense, rather than conspiracy fear and defending services that are red flags

and if still unhappy and want to cry about red flags.. go complain to the idols you love so much at DCG who own exchanges and coinanalysis companies and tell them how they are ruining your experience

We actually had exactly that in the early-mid 2000s - No Tor, practically no HTTPS anywhere, the NSAKEY heyday at its height cause everyone was using Windows (I shall mention gaping scurity vulnerabilities in pretty much every software not the least Internet Explorer while we're on that topic), no Bitcoin obviously - and all this is after the Patriot Act which basically allowed the NSA to get whatever info it wants.