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    • michaelb87
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    October 17, 2014, 08:08:21 AM
     #461
    Quote from: Kuriso on October 17, 2014, 12:33:41 AM
    Quote
    2) More fair distribution vs price per coin.  There are only 4.5 millions BRO offered in the ICO and an uncapped ICO would not allow the Bill Gates to scoop up most or all of the coins
    Not really.  'Bill Gates' or the 'whales' can still dump more btc than any other users and gain a higher % of the coins.  

    Example 1: If 10 people give 10btc or 1 btc each, it wont matter.  They each get 1/10th of the 4.5 million coins with equal buy-ins.  The only thing that changes is the theoretical market cap.  No 'Bill Gates' here but this will not happen either.
     
    Example 2: If 9 people give 1btc and 1 person gives 10btc, the MC is 19btc or 236,842bro per btc.  9 people get 236,842bro and 1 person gets 2,368,420bro.  You have a 'Bill Gates'.

    Example 3: If 100 people give an avg of .5btc each and 10 people give an average of 5btc each, you have a MC of 100 btc or 45,000bro per btc.  100 people get avg of 22,500bro each and 10 people get 225,000bro each.  Now you have 10 'Bill Gates'.

    Of course these are over simplified but the idea is still the same no matter how many investors join or the amount of btc paid in.  You will always have a 'Bill Gates'.  The idea of an uncapped ICO not allowing a 'Bill Gates' is erroneous imho.


    Quote
    3)  The assumption that uncapped ICO will generate money money than a capped ICO is erroneous imho

    Really?  Did you see how much bitcoin the Ether project raised with their uncapped ICO?  An uncapped ICOs will most likely not benefit the investors unless very little bitcoin is paid in.  Based on past experiences, it will almost certainly only benefit you, the devs.



    Potential ICO investors, remember this is a ICO/POW coin.  Miners are generally dumpers.  Looks like there are coins being given away free as well.  These can be dumped at any price.  You are paying a flat fee for the coins but you have no idea what that fee will be.  It will change as more btc is paid in.  Things actually get worse as you have more investors spending more btc.  Roughly 9,500bro will be mined every day.  As the potential market cap grows from the ICO, the daily cost in keeping the market price steady will increase.  

    Will the amount of BTC raised be public so that investors can judge their potential holdings and cost per BRO?

    I'm very, very interested in getting in on this coin but the uncapped limit is almost a deal breaker.  I'd only be a buyer at the end of the 30 days and with less than 500 btc raised.  That puts the MC low and at a really reasonable price.

    +10000.

    Without a cap there is no way I'm investing. Guaranteed loss if you do invest, especially with POW dumpers. Cap should be MAX 400 BTC, everything above that will guarantee a loss.

    Look at SysCoin. They raised about 460 BTC and had a wat better businessplan but still people lost on it. More than 400 BTC makes sure all demand is sucked dry into the ICO and nobody willing to buy after the ICO.

    I'm so tired of these greedy devs. Just be happy with 400 BTC, that's a huge amount! Take some pride in your work. Everybody here wants to hit the jackpot first and work after. That's not real life

  • barabbas
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    October 17, 2014, 08:17:36 AM
     #462
    Quote from: jaybny on October 17, 2014, 06:02:33 AM
    Quote from: barabbas on October 17, 2014, 05:48:06 AM
    You start dumping. And continue dumping. And continue dumping, as the price dives. You dump until it goes to 500, not just because you dump but because people panic sell. At 500, you start buying. And price goes back up. Rinse and repeat.

    what is your average selling price on the way down and what is your average buying price on the way back up? this is the only thing that determines alpha in this simple strategy. take a look at bottoms or lows at any free market. what do you notice?    



    notice the volume spikes at the lows? this brings the vwap down on the way down and up on the way up.  prices move towards liquidity, not away from it. prices bottom when selling stops, the buyers at lows are not overwhelming, yet the snap back is so violent, simply due of lack of sellers. there is where liquidity in reality kills the backtested alpha.

    this strategy has no alpha for the big player, maybe there are weak hands that capitulate at tops and bottoms, and this strategy works for a mid size player, by making an aggressive sell to start an avalanche of stops. the big player has better alpha providing heavy liquidly on both sides, and given that the gaming company wants to retain its players, and players don't like to be exposed to extreme volatility, i would say the alpha is in providing liquidity, rather then starting a panic.

    Jay, I know you are fully aware of the term "capitulation". You can provoke that daily or even more frequently if you want to. That's where the scoop comes. And you can also control the rebound. You can control it both ways and determine tops and bottoms.

    As for the price being stable, I don't know if that's even desirable or attractive to cryptonites... where are they going to make money to justify their investment if the price remains stable?  

  • barabbas
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    October 17, 2014, 08:22:20 AM
     #463
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 08:08:21 AM
    Quote from: Kuriso on October 17, 2014, 12:33:41 AM
    Quote
    2) More fair distribution vs price per coin.  There are only 4.5 millions BRO offered in the ICO and an uncapped ICO would not allow the Bill Gates to scoop up most or all of the coins
    Not really.  'Bill Gates' or the 'whales' can still dump more btc than any other users and gain a higher % of the coins.  

    Example 1: If 10 people give 10btc or 1 btc each, it wont matter.  They each get 1/10th of the 4.5 million coins with equal buy-ins.  The only thing that changes is the theoretical market cap.  No 'Bill Gates' here but this will not happen either.
     
    Example 2: If 9 people give 1btc and 1 person gives 10btc, the MC is 19btc or 236,842bro per btc.  9 people get 236,842bro and 1 person gets 2,368,420bro.  You have a 'Bill Gates'.

    Example 3: If 100 people give an avg of .5btc each and 10 people give an average of 5btc each, you have a MC of 100 btc or 45,000bro per btc.  100 people get avg of 22,500bro each and 10 people get 225,000bro each.  Now you have 10 'Bill Gates'.

    Of course these are over simplified but the idea is still the same no matter how many investors join or the amount of btc paid in.  You will always have a 'Bill Gates'.  The idea of an uncapped ICO not allowing a 'Bill Gates' is erroneous imho.


    Quote
    3)  The assumption that uncapped ICO will generate money money than a capped ICO is erroneous imho

    Really?  Did you see how much bitcoin the Ether project raised with their uncapped ICO?  An uncapped ICOs will most likely not benefit the investors unless very little bitcoin is paid in.  Based on past experiences, it will almost certainly only benefit you, the devs.



    Potential ICO investors, remember this is a ICO/POW coin.  Miners are generally dumpers.  Looks like there are coins being given away free as well.  These can be dumped at any price.  You are paying a flat fee for the coins but you have no idea what that fee will be.  It will change as more btc is paid in.  Things actually get worse as you have more investors spending more btc.  Roughly 9,500bro will be mined every day.  As the potential market cap grows from the ICO, the daily cost in keeping the market price steady will increase.  

    Will the amount of BTC raised be public so that investors can judge their potential holdings and cost per BRO?

    I'm very, very interested in getting in on this coin but the uncapped limit is almost a deal breaker.  I'd only be a buyer at the end of the 30 days and with less than 500 btc raised.  That puts the MC low and at a really reasonable price.

    +10000.

    Without a cap there is no way I'm investing. Guaranteed loss if you do invest, especially with POW dumpers. Cap should be MAX 400 BTC, everything above that will guarantee a loss.

    Look at SysCoin. They raised about 460 BTC and had a wat better businessplan but still people lost on it. More than 400 BTC makes sure all demand is sucked dry into the ICO and nobody willing to buy after the ICO.

    I'm so tired of these greedy devs. Just be happy with 400 BTC, that's a huge amount! Take some pride in your work. Everybody here wants to hit the jackpot first and work after. That's not real life


    Sorry but that is very juvenile perception. This is a BUSINESS. With investors behind it. A business that requires big money to be built. It doesn't matter one bit if the cap the price or not, nothing changes the outcome. This will get whatever amount of BTC it will and that will be the same whether it is capped or not. The price of the coin is irrelevant, the only measure that matters is the market cap assigned to the entire supply, not the price per coin of the 4.5 million on offer.

  • michaelb87
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    October 17, 2014, 12:24:22 PM
     #464
    Quote from: barabbas on October 17, 2014, 08:22:20 AM
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 08:08:21 AM
    Quote from: Kuriso on October 17, 2014, 12:33:41 AM
    Quote
    2) More fair distribution vs price per coin.  There are only 4.5 millions BRO offered in the ICO and an uncapped ICO would not allow the Bill Gates to scoop up most or all of the coins
    Not really.  'Bill Gates' or the 'whales' can still dump more btc than any other users and gain a higher % of the coins.  

    Example 1: If 10 people give 10btc or 1 btc each, it wont matter.  They each get 1/10th of the 4.5 million coins with equal buy-ins.  The only thing that changes is the theoretical market cap.  No 'Bill Gates' here but this will not happen either.
     
    Example 2: If 9 people give 1btc and 1 person gives 10btc, the MC is 19btc or 236,842bro per btc.  9 people get 236,842bro and 1 person gets 2,368,420bro.  You have a 'Bill Gates'.

    Example 3: If 100 people give an avg of .5btc each and 10 people give an average of 5btc each, you have a MC of 100 btc or 45,000bro per btc.  100 people get avg of 22,500bro each and 10 people get 225,000bro each.  Now you have 10 'Bill Gates'.

    Of course these are over simplified but the idea is still the same no matter how many investors join or the amount of btc paid in.  You will always have a 'Bill Gates'.  The idea of an uncapped ICO not allowing a 'Bill Gates' is erroneous imho.


    Quote
    3)  The assumption that uncapped ICO will generate money money than a capped ICO is erroneous imho

    Really?  Did you see how much bitcoin the Ether project raised with their uncapped ICO?  An uncapped ICOs will most likely not benefit the investors unless very little bitcoin is paid in.  Based on past experiences, it will almost certainly only benefit you, the devs.



    Potential ICO investors, remember this is a ICO/POW coin.  Miners are generally dumpers.  Looks like there are coins being given away free as well.  These can be dumped at any price.  You are paying a flat fee for the coins but you have no idea what that fee will be.  It will change as more btc is paid in.  Things actually get worse as you have more investors spending more btc.  Roughly 9,500bro will be mined every day.  As the potential market cap grows from the ICO, the daily cost in keeping the market price steady will increase.  

    Will the amount of BTC raised be public so that investors can judge their potential holdings and cost per BRO?

    I'm very, very interested in getting in on this coin but the uncapped limit is almost a deal breaker.  I'd only be a buyer at the end of the 30 days and with less than 500 btc raised.  That puts the MC low and at a really reasonable price.

    +10000.

    Without a cap there is no way I'm investing. Guaranteed loss if you do invest, especially with POW dumpers. Cap should be MAX 400 BTC, everything above that will guarantee a loss.

    Look at SysCoin. They raised about 460 BTC and had a wat better businessplan but still people lost on it. More than 400 BTC makes sure all demand is sucked dry into the ICO and nobody willing to buy after the ICO.

    I'm so tired of these greedy devs. Just be happy with 400 BTC, that's a huge amount! Take some pride in your work. Everybody here wants to hit the jackpot first and work after. That's not real life


    Sorry but that is very juvenile perception. This is a BUSINESS. With investors behind it. A business that requires big money to be built. It doesn't matter one bit if the cap the price or not, nothing changes the outcome. This will get whatever amount of BTC it will and that will be the same whether it is capped or not. The price of the coin is irrelevant, the only measure that matters is the market cap assigned to the entire supply, not the price per coin of the 4.5 million on offer.

    Dream on. Most investors are here solely for a quick profit, not everybody, but most of them. I've seem them all come by. And that's not a bad thing. Let us support the build and launch of a coin, take our profit and let others get in for the long term.

    But respect that type of investor because they are 80% of your potential investors. Uncapped ICO's will leave them with a loss which is a bad thing for crypto in general. Looks like greedy devs screwing people over.

    Make an ICO reasonable or don't do it at all.

  • jaybny
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    October 17, 2014, 02:28:35 PM
     #465
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 12:24:22 PM
    Make an ICO reasonable or don't do it at all.

    please explain what a capped ICO is? Are we supposed to be deciding the price and the quantity? If so we would be deciding the initial market-cap of the coin? Isn't that for the market to decide?

    If we set price to high, there will be no buyers, if we set price to low, it will be sold in in minutes, and the distribution will be centralized.

    Quote
    Uncapped ICO's will leave them with a loss which is a bad thing for crypto in general. Looks like greedy devs screwing people over.
    If this is known, shouldn't the market adjust itself for this? If uncapped produces losses, then there should be less buying interest, which would eventually produce profits, and this should go back and forth until the market finds value.
    Bloomberg '98, Fortress '07, Bitcoin '10, Sidepit '23 ☀️ᚠ 🥪

  • jibble
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    October 17, 2014, 03:17:47 PM
     #466
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 08:08:21 AM

    +10000.

    Without a cap there is no way I'm investing. Guaranteed loss if you do invest, especially with POW dumpers. Cap should be MAX 400 BTC, everything above that will guarantee a loss.

    Look at SysCoin. They raised about 460 BTC and had a wat better businessplan but still people lost on it. More than 400 BTC makes sure all demand is sucked dry into the ICO and nobody willing to buy after the ICO.

    I'm so tired of these greedy devs. Just be happy with 400 BTC, that's a huge amount! Take some pride in your work. Everybody here wants to hit the jackpot first and work after. That's not real life


    Eveerything you said here is verifiable bullshit, there have been numerous IPO's that have a fraction of the plans/feature and developments that have raised 900btc+ and investors have profited

    Sys coin raised about 1500 btc and then on release it fucked up causing massive panic and people dumping at a loss.

    I am so tired of people who can't even write truthful details , either you are trying to manipulate the facts to try and make them set a really low cap on investment or you really are a stupid fucker that just guesses shit without even researching, or just remembering what actually happened previously, it wasn't even that long ago, you could of just looked up what you were talking about instead of talking 100% bullsht

  • brother3
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    October 17, 2014, 03:51:02 PM
    Last edit: October 17, 2014, 06:05:34 PM by brother3
     #467
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 08:08:21 AM

    +10000.

    Without a cap there is no way I'm investing. Guaranteed loss if you do invest, especially with POW dumpers. Cap should be MAX 400 BTC, everything above that will guarantee a loss.

    Look at SysCoin. They raised about 460 BTC and had a wat better businessplan but still people lost on it. More than 400 BTC makes sure all demand is sucked dry into the ICO and nobody willing to buy after the ICO.

    I'm so tired of these greedy devs. Just be happy with 400 BTC, that's a huge amount! Take some pride in your work. Everybody here wants to hit the jackpot first and work after. That's not real life


    I won't get into whether Syscoin has a better business plan, but i thought the initial ico was 460 btc or so raised but the total ipo raised 1500 btc no?

  • BreakoutGaming
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    October 17, 2014, 05:31:51 PM
    Last edit: October 29, 2014, 12:49:15 AM by BreakoutGaming
     #468
    Quote from: jibble on October 17, 2014, 03:17:47 PM
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 08:08:21 AM

    +10000.

    Without a cap there is no way I'm investing. Guaranteed loss if you do invest, especially with POW dumpers. Cap should be MAX 400 BTC, everything above that will guarantee a loss.

    Look at SysCoin. They raised about 460 BTC and had a wat better businessplan but still people lost on it. More than 400 BTC makes sure all demand is sucked dry into the ICO and nobody willing to buy after the ICO.

    I'm so tired of these greedy devs. Just be happy with 400 BTC, that's a huge amount! Take some pride in your work. Everybody here wants to hit the jackpot first and work after. That's not real life


    Eveerything you said here is verifiable bullshit, there have been numerous IPO's that have a fraction of the plans/feature and developments that have raised 900btc+ and investors have profited

    Sys coin raised about 1500 btc and then on release it fucked up causing massive panic and people dumping at a loss.

    I am so tired of people who can't even write truthful details , either you are trying to manipulate the facts to try and make them set a really low cap on investment or you really are a stupid fucker that just guesses shit without even researching, or just remembering what actually happened previously, it wasn't even that long ago, you could of just looked up what you were talking about instead of talking 100% bullsht

    Fyi, Breakout has already invested significant  capital into this project. This is not a conceptual project or investment. We have put a lot of sweat and capital to get the project to where we are now. Breakout Gaming will launch and follow our business plan to success.


    The entire Breakout Team is all in. We truly believe in the the future of Cryptocurrencies and Gaming. The Breakout Team is dedicated to make this project a tremendous success. The participants in our crowd sale will also be receiving Bergstake and the right to mine all future coins.  Bergstake is potentially a bigger reward than the coins. This is the first time I can think of, where a crowd sale provided as much leverage and incentive to buyin as Bergstake.

    Disclaimer: Breakout Coin and Breakout Gaming are two separate services/entities.  Breakout Coin is offering BRO coins for btc. By participating in this "coin sale," you are not purchasing interest in Breakout Gaming.  You are solely participating in the "coin sale" of a crypto coin that happens to have a gaming company that supports the BRO coin by having their chips denominated in the BRO crypto coin.

    As specified in the first paragraph in the Terms and Conditions:

    WARNING:  Do not purchase BRO if you are not an expert in crypto tokens or currency and blockchain technology.

    This coin sale is not an offer of investment or securities in any business, venture, or company, or in any form of gaming operations or activity; purchase of BRO does not entitle the buyer to any interest in any profits or revenue of any common enterprise arising from the activities of others.
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
    ████ ★ BREAKOUT STAKE ★ WEBSITE ★ MULTICURRENCY SMART CONTRACTS + SIDECHAINS ★ ANN ★  COINSALE July 10 – July 24  ████
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

  • jibble
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    October 17, 2014, 05:57:12 PM
     #469
    Quote from: BreakoutGaming on October 17, 2014, 05:31:51 PM
    Quote from: jibble on October 17, 2014, 03:17:47 PM
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 08:08:21 AM

    +10000.

    Without a cap there is no way I'm investing. Guaranteed loss if you do invest, especially with POW dumpers. Cap should be MAX 400 BTC, everything above that will guarantee a loss.

    Look at SysCoin. They raised about 460 BTC and had a wat better businessplan but still people lost on it. More than 400 BTC makes sure all demand is sucked dry into the ICO and nobody willing to buy after the ICO.

    I'm so tired of these greedy devs. Just be happy with 400 BTC, that's a huge amount! Take some pride in your work. Everybody here wants to hit the jackpot first and work after. That's not real life


    Eveerything you said here is verifiable bullshit, there have been numerous IPO's that have a fraction of the plans/feature and developments that have raised 900btc+ and investors have profited

    Sys coin raised about 1500 btc and then on release it fucked up causing massive panic and people dumping at a loss.

    I am so tired of people who can't even write truthful details , either you are trying to manipulate the facts to try and make them set a really low cap on investment or you really are a stupid fucker that just guesses shit without even researching, or just remembering what actually happened previously, it wasn't even that long ago, you could of just looked up what you were talking about instead of talking 100% bullsht

    Fyi, Breakout has already invested significant  capital into this project. This is not a conceptual project or investment. We have put a lot of sweat and capital to get the project to where we are now. Breakout will launch and follow our business plan to success.


    The entire Breakout Team is all in. We truly believe in the the future of Cryptocurrencies and Gaming. The Breakout Team is dedicated to make this project a tremendous success and the investors should see growth if we execute properly. The investors in our crowd sale will also be receiving Bergstake and the right to mine all future coins.  Bergstake is potentially a bigger reward than the coins. This is the first time I can think of, where a crowd sale provided as much leverage and incentive to buyin as Bergstake.

    I agree with what you are saying.

    I am going to be buying into the IPO on release day to take advantage of bergstake , to allow me to steadily earn in the long term.

    I was simply stating the information given by the person who provided it was false.

    Syscoin raised 460 btc : No. it raised around 1500 btc in their IPO

    everything above 400btc will guarantee a loss : No. there is historical data that proves that statement to be completely false, there have been numerous coins that have raised over 400btc and made profits. most with less foundation work and infrastructure in comparison to breakout.

    The person was emotionally driven, given the fact he cherry picked information to back up his own opinion information that was fabricated bullshit, totally false .

  • ofortuna
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    October 17, 2014, 06:44:13 PM
     #470
    Quote from: jibble on October 17, 2014, 05:57:12 PM
    Quote from: BreakoutGaming on October 17, 2014, 05:31:51 PM
    Quote from: jibble on October 17, 2014, 03:17:47 PM
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 08:08:21 AM

    +10000.

    Without a cap there is no way I'm investing. Guaranteed loss if you do invest, especially with POW dumpers. Cap should be MAX 400 BTC, everything above that will guarantee a loss.

    Look at SysCoin. They raised about 460 BTC and had a wat better businessplan but still people lost on it. More than 400 BTC makes sure all demand is sucked dry into the ICO and nobody willing to buy after the ICO.

    I'm so tired of these greedy devs. Just be happy with 400 BTC, that's a huge amount! Take some pride in your work. Everybody here wants to hit the jackpot first and work after. That's not real life


    Eveerything you said here is verifiable bullshit, there have been numerous IPO's that have a fraction of the plans/feature and developments that have raised 900btc+ and investors have profited

    Sys coin raised about 1500 btc and then on release it fucked up causing massive panic and people dumping at a loss.

    I am so tired of people who can't even write truthful details , either you are trying to manipulate the facts to try and make them set a really low cap on investment or you really are a stupid fucker that just guesses shit without even researching, or just remembering what actually happened previously, it wasn't even that long ago, you could of just looked up what you were talking about instead of talking 100% bullsht

    Fyi, Breakout has already invested significant  capital into this project. This is not a conceptual project or investment. We have put a lot of sweat and capital to get the project to where we are now. Breakout will launch and follow our business plan to success.


    The entire Breakout Team is all in. We truly believe in the the future of Cryptocurrencies and Gaming. The Breakout Team is dedicated to make this project a tremendous success and the investors should see growth if we execute properly. The investors in our crowd sale will also be receiving Bergstake and the right to mine all future coins.  Bergstake is potentially a bigger reward than the coins. This is the first time I can think of, where a crowd sale provided as much leverage and incentive to buyin as Bergstake.

    I agree with what you are saying.

    I am going to be buying into the IPO on release day to take advantage of bergstake , to allow me to steadily earn in the long term.

    I was simply stating the information given by the person who provided it was false.

    Syscoin raised 460 btc : No. it raised around 1500 btc in their IPO

    everything above 400btc will guarantee a loss : No. there is historical data that proves that statement to be completely false, there have been numerous coins that have raised over 400btc and made profits. most with less foundation work and infrastructure in comparison to breakout.

    The person was emotionally driven, given the fact he cherry picked information to back up his own opinion information that was fabricated bullshit, totally false .

    Thank you Jibble  Grin

    Through discussion on this thread and the presentation on Breakoutcoin.com, we are trying to get the word out about the cohesive long term plan as best we can.  When people come in with preconceived notions, biases based on their past experiences, or focus on a single detail of Breakout Coin, often they don't get that we are very different than the typical coin project armed with just a whitepaper.

    Thank you setting the record straight and your highly valued support!
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
    ████ ★ BREAKOUT STAKE ★ WEBSITE ★ MULTICURRENCY SMART CONTRACTS + SIDECHAINS ★ ANN ★  COINSALE July 10 – July 24  ████
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬

  • illodin
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    October 17, 2014, 07:29:02 PM
     #471
    Regarding the unlimited ICO - if you'd like to invest 1 BTC, but don't know what to do because it's unlimited. Hedge your bets and use 0.5 BTC in the ICO, and 0.5 BTC to buy from the exchanges after the ICO. Problem solved?

  • illodin
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    October 17, 2014, 07:30:10 PM
     #472
    Quote from: duckfever on October 15, 2014, 12:03:00 PM
    imo there's too much going on with the poker table designs, I say this as a long term grinder myself. will there be a simplified table option ?

    Yes, if you want a lot of action, you should please multi-tablers as well.

    Easy to customize graphics (or give enough simple themes to choose from), easy to script UI (so people can make AHK scripts to help betting/folding/raising etc) or make it built in to be able to define customized hotkeys with customized actions for any given situation. Please consult some of the multi-tablers and those who make the betting scripts/tools for currently existing sites.

    And an option to display bb amounts instead of absolute BRO values is important.. so if you multi-table different stakes you can just 3bet to 9bb for example without doing extra calculations.

    And most importantly, make the rake low enough. Like, very low. Dealing with crypto should minimize the losses poker sites usually get from charge backs etc.

  • illodin
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    October 17, 2014, 07:32:11 PM
     #473
    Quote from: JakeThePanda on October 08, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
    Quote from: Randy M Kim on October 08, 2014, 03:25:15 PM
    Quote from: illodin on October 07, 2014, 01:32:43 PM
    Quote from: Randy M Kim on October 03, 2014, 11:48:30 PM
    If anyone has any questions for our poker pros please let me know.  I will forward to our poker agents promptly

    How do you play Axs preflop?
    Very carefully.😉
    Too general.  

    What position are you in?
    What was the action before you?  
    Rule #1, always look left.  Who's to your left and what reads do you have?  
    Tight or loose table?
    Short handed game or full ring? How many players at the table?
    Stack sizes?
    Cash game or Tourney?  
    What's your image at the table?
    Ace rag or what?

    Answer those and then we can almost get started with the decision process.  Another X amount of questions to consider based on those answers.

    If you didn't even consider this right out of the gate then you're just a home game fish.  Grin

    Ok sorry I wasn't specific.

    I'm the SB, and everyone has folded to me. BB is a huge fish who will call any amount with any two preflop, and fold to any small bet on the flop unless he hits a set or better. Stacks are 100bb, and it's a cash game. My image is very tight, I've only been seen betting when I have a monster, and never got caught bluffing.









     Wink

  • JakeThePanda
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    October 17, 2014, 07:47:18 PM
    Last edit: October 17, 2014, 08:03:11 PM by JakeThePanda
     #474
    Quote from: illodin on October 17, 2014, 07:32:11 PM
    Quote from: JakeThePanda on October 08, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
    Quote from: Randy M Kim on October 08, 2014, 03:25:15 PM
    Quote from: illodin on October 07, 2014, 01:32:43 PM
    Quote from: Randy M Kim on October 03, 2014, 11:48:30 PM
    If anyone has any questions for our poker pros please let me know.  I will forward to our poker agents promptly

    How do you play Axs preflop?
    Very carefully.😉
    Too general.  

    What position are you in?
    What was the action before you?  
    Rule #1, always look left.  Who's to your left and what reads do you have?  
    Tight or loose table?
    Short handed game or full ring? How many players at the table?
    Stack sizes?
    Cash game or Tourney?  
    What's your image at the table?
    Ace rag or what?

    Answer those and then we can almost get started with the decision process.  Another X amount of questions to consider based on those answers.

    If you didn't even consider this right out of the gate then you're just a home game fish.  Grin

    Ok sorry I wasn't specific.

    I'm the SB, and everyone has folded to me. BB is a huge fish who will call any amount with any two preflop, and fold to any small bet on the flop unless he hits a set or better. Stacks are 100bb, and it's a cash game. My image is very tight, I've only been seen betting when I have a monster, and never got caught bluffing.









     Wink

    If villain is a huge fish I want to play as many hands as possible with him, even if I'm OOP.  I would prefer if he was directly to my right, so I will immediately jump on the seat to his left (The Jesus Seat)  if it opens up, without making it obvious of course.  But, the table has already let me isolate him even if it's OOP, so yes they are probably ultra tight.  OOP, who cares, he's a fish and folds too often to cointinuation Grin bets. The dude to my right is probably also a fish if he didn't try to isolate the main fish while he was on the button.  Since villain is a huge fish, he probably didn't notice or care that you play very tight anyway.  

    Open 3x, maybe 4x because he folds so often to Cbets. Cbet something on the smallish side.  He only calls Cbets when he has a big hand so a big Cbet will only hurt you.  

  • Skatebird
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    October 17, 2014, 09:05:30 PM
    Last edit: October 17, 2014, 09:16:22 PM by Skatebird
     #475
    Quote from: jaybny on October 17, 2014, 02:28:35 PM
    Quote from: michaelb87 on October 17, 2014, 12:24:22 PM
    Make an ICO reasonable or don't do it at all.

    please explain what a capped ICO is? Are we supposed to be deciding the price and the quantity? If so we would be deciding the initial market-cap of the coin? Isn't that for the market to decide?

    If we set price to high, there will be no buyers, if we set price to low, it will be sold in in minutes, and the distribution will be centralized.

    Quote
    Uncapped ICO's will leave them with a loss which is a bad thing for crypto in general. Looks like greedy devs screwing people over.
    If this is known, shouldn't the market adjust itself for this? If uncapped produces losses, then there should be less buying interest, which would eventually produce profits, and this should go back and forth until the market finds value.



    We all know devs dont want to cap ICO because they are greedy and want max of btc. Real big business dont need unlimited ICO to start and make money. Listen to Dragons Den if you want to validate... In real life,  People work hard and compagnies gain value, thats the way it should work here too. ICO is just suppose to help you at beginning, not pay you for your entire life... Btw, by cap ICO, you give the chance to early investors to get in fast in the project and free market will decide of the market cap after. Its really easy to understand !!! Can we know the fuckin price before investing money ?lolllllll
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  • ofortuna
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    October 17, 2014, 09:28:14 PM
     #476
    Quote from: JakeThePanda on October 17, 2014, 07:47:18 PM
    Quote from: illodin on October 17, 2014, 07:32:11 PM
    Quote from: JakeThePanda on October 08, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
    Quote from: Randy M Kim on October 08, 2014, 03:25:15 PM
    Quote from: illodin on October 07, 2014, 01:32:43 PM
    Quote from: Randy M Kim on October 03, 2014, 11:48:30 PM
    If anyone has any questions for our poker pros please let me know.  I will forward to our poker agents promptly

    How do you play Axs preflop?
    Very carefully.😉
    Too general.  

    What position are you in?
    What was the action before you?  
    Rule #1, always look left.  Who's to your left and what reads do you have?  
    Tight or loose table?
    Short handed game or full ring? How many players at the table?
    Stack sizes?
    Cash game or Tourney?  
    What's your image at the table?
    Ace rag or what?

    Answer those and then we can almost get started with the decision process.  Another X amount of questions to consider based on those answers.

    If you didn't even consider this right out of the gate then you're just a home game fish.  Grin

    Ok sorry I wasn't specific.

    I'm the SB, and everyone has folded to me. BB is a huge fish who will call any amount with any two preflop, and fold to any small bet on the flop unless he hits a set or better. Stacks are 100bb, and it's a cash game. My image is very tight, I've only been seen betting when I have a monster, and never got caught bluffing.









     Wink

    If villain is a huge fish I want to play as many hands as possible with him, even if I'm OOP.  I would prefer if he was directly to my right, so I will immediately jump on the seat to his left (The Jesus Seat)  if it opens up, without making it obvious of course.  But, the table has already let me isolate him even if it's OOP, so yes they are probably ultra tight.  OOP, who cares, he's a fish and folds too often to cointinuation Grin bets. The dude to my right is probably also a fish if he didn't try to isolate the main fish while he was on the button.  Since villain is a huge fish, he probably didn't notice or care that you play very tight anyway.  

    Open 3x, maybe 4x because he folds so often to Cbets. Cbet something on the smallish side.  He only calls Cbets when he has a big hand so a big Cbet will only hurt you.  



    If someone plays that loose before the flop and that tight on the flop, I would raise preflop as much as he will call and always C-bet.  With any hand.  At least until he adjusts.. if he adjusts.

    This is a dream opponent.

    However, most players that are super loose and passive preflop continue this trend post flop.

    At least that's my 2 BROS worth.
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    ████ ★ BREAKOUT STAKE ★ WEBSITE ★ MULTICURRENCY SMART CONTRACTS + SIDECHAINS ★ ANN ★  COINSALE July 10 – July 24  ████
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  • brother3
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    October 17, 2014, 10:27:48 PM
     #477
    Quote from: illodin on October 17, 2014, 07:29:02 PM
    Regarding the unlimited ICO - if you'd like to invest 1 BTC, but don't know what to do because it's unlimited. Hedge your bets and use 0.5 BTC in the ICO, and 0.5 BTC to buy from the exchanges after the ICO. Problem solved?

    Great suggestion!

  • jaybny
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    October 17, 2014, 10:28:20 PM
     #478
    Quote from: Skatebird on October 17, 2014, 09:05:30 PM
    Its really easy to understand !!! Can we know the fuckin price before investing money ?lolllllll

    do you expect us to give you a price for the 4.5 million coins? If so, we would be setting our own market-cap. Companies NEVER choose their own valuations, markets do.

    or do you just want a price, with an uncapped number of coins?  If so, I understand why this would would make you feel better.. but its exactly the same. either price or quantity can be fixed , not both. if you want both, i would suggest you wait to buy in the secondary market.
    Bloomberg '98, Fortress '07, Bitcoin '10, Sidepit '23 ☀️ᚠ 🥪

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    October 17, 2014, 10:29:06 PM
    Last edit: October 17, 2014, 11:53:23 PM by jaybny
     #479
    Quote from: brother3 on October 17, 2014, 10:27:48 PM
    Quote from: illodin on October 17, 2014, 07:29:02 PM
    Regarding the unlimited ICO - if you'd like to invest 1 BTC, but don't know what to do because it's unlimited. Hedge your bets and use 0.5 BTC in the ICO, and 0.5 BTC to buy from the exchanges after the ICO. Problem solved?

    Great suggestion!

    not

    in general, uncapped ico does NOT imply a lower price in the secondary market. if it did, then none should invest in the ico and everyone should wait for the secondary market.

    in our case its a bit different because in-fact ico coins are more valuable then secondary market coins due to to expected-value of the bergstake.  so in our case, the price of  the ico coins will be higher then the expected price of the secondary market coins. However, the expected-value of the ico coins is higher then the expected-value of secondary market coins.

    expected-price(ico coins) = expected-price(secondary market coins) + [ ev(future bergstake coins) discounted for time]

    edit:
    piece of personal advise i once heard: "one should not invest because of expected returns. one should only invest with risk capital if and only if this risk capital had been put aside "BEFORE", the opportunity presented itself".

    this is not early days of bitcoin, this is a serious project with real long term commitments and implications. expect coin to be priced at value. the days of ordering pizza with 10,000 bitcoin are just biblical stories from yesteryears.   


     
    Bloomberg '98, Fortress '07, Bitcoin '10, Sidepit '23 ☀️ᚠ 🥪

  • BreakoutGaming
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    October 17, 2014, 10:39:52 PM
     #480
    Preview a DEMO of our digital hub and games.  When launched, players will have access to the exchange, Poker, Fantasy Sports, Crypto Fantasy etc.. with one universal ID.

    http://fundraiser.breakoutgaming.com/breakout-gaming-preview/

    http://fundraiser.breakoutgaming.com/gaming-platform/
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    ████ ★ BREAKOUT STAKE ★ WEBSITE ★ MULTICURRENCY SMART CONTRACTS + SIDECHAINS ★ ANN ★  COINSALE July 10 – July 24  ████
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
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