By saying that you make two things clear:

1. You have not been following the discussion of the thread.
2. You are thinking in fiat standard terms, not in bitcoin standard.

I just don't want to explain these things again, which have already been explained in the thread ad nauseam.

Popularized by Michael Saylor, “Bitcoin torque” refers to the extra value generated per dollar invested in Bitcoin.

Torque = current value of Bitcoin holdings ÷ total dollars spent

It applies equally to mining capex, convertible bonds, or spot purchases. Every dollar in counts the same.

By this measure, Tesla and Block stand out as top performers thanks to their early buy-in and stack retention.


https://www.talkimg.com/images/2025/05/14/UUgWQP.jpeg

https://x.com/BitcoinNewsCom/status/1922644747971125566?t=E_FT-0PD0hO7tXmN57xX3g&s=19

They are very far from being overleveraged. If you watch the latest earnings call from like a week ago, Saylor showed an updated spreadsheet with asset to liability ratios and you could see the % of leveraged capital, you could also go to MSTR True North twitter or Youtube channel and look up their latest episode, they have spreadsheets that they keep updating. Also Adam Back has said that they are underleveraged. Btw Adam Back is joining another Bitcoin treasury company that will use EUR as native currency for the fund so this would be another way for EU investors to get in. You can check it out with ticker ALTBG.

The first people to get paid in a leverage trader should be the debt holders, so that's convertible bond holders, STRK, STRF and so on. So yes, MSTR holders will get most of the flak, but that is the price you pay to get most of the upside. When this stock runs, it runs real nice, it comes with the territory accepting these risk. The good news is, as explained, it would require some sort of ridiculous black swan that would need to make BTC fail. This has been a losing trade for the last 15+ years, so MSTR shorts will eventually pay for trying to guess that this time is different and they will get the end of BTC right. Jim Chanos, after losing a lot of money on TSLA shorts, now it's trying to short MSTR. These guys appear every 6 months or so (Kerrisdale, Citron, now Jim Chanos and so on). The price went higher than their entry points eventually.

They recently released a Financial Times video-documentary thing on Strategy's Bitcoin strategy and they had Jeff Punter from MSTR True North podcast explaining the Saylor playbook, Saylor was on the show too as well as some analysts and it was funny since the TV presenter claimed how her teeth is useful and scarce but not worth 100k a piece, so this shows we are still very early since the digital scarcity of BTC is still not understood by most people. Sometimes you forget that you are on niche communities where most people have above average understanding of BTC, but the mainstream take is still either neutral or short BTC, and certainly MSTR because that is even more complex of a trade to understand which is why we see these "long BTC/short MSTR" takes. Eventually we will see another gamma squeeze and the price will skyrocket as these people pile up on the short side.

That's right, the FT is widely known for making a fool of themselves with MSTR, but in terms of not understanding bitcoin they are not alone, and things like this make me think we are at the beginning of the rise of the S-Curve. Here on the forum, as bitcoin is already 16 years old, and we see the progress there is in terms of institutional and state adoption there are people who think it's late, as opposed to buying bitcoin 10 or 15 years ago. But the fact that there are so many people, and so many financial analysts who don't understand what it's all about makes me think it's still too early if someone starts buying bitcoin now or has been buying for a while but is not satisfied with their holdings.

I think it's Mark Moss who I've seen explain about the S-Curve, where basically the first few years are very volatile and few people find out what it's all about but after a decade or so that's when the technology starts to expand to widespread global adoption.

With this I do not mean that in the future everyone will have bitcoin, in the same way that not everyone has gold but in the future having some sats or having exposure to bitcoin (for example because in your retirement fund you have companies that have bitcoin in their treasury) will be as normal as having a ring or some kind of gold jewelry at home.

MSTR is already in the Nasdaq 100, Coinbase this week entered in the S&P 500.

Bitcoin is going to remain as a kind of investment that the earlier you get in, the better, yet an ongoing incentive should exist to get into bitcoin sooner rather than later, even if there might be perceptions of a short-term price bubble.

It is quite likely that we are in the midst of an s-curve which can sometimes be difficult to see, while at the same time the upwards slope of the price rises is becoming more and more gradual with the passage of time, even though along the way there are going to be short-term periods of exponential growth, over-exuberance and also severe corrections... yet even with all of the volatility, it is likely best for individuals and/or institutions to buy bitcoin regularly and persistency, and surely in terms of individuals it can take 30-40 years to build a sizable investment portfolio, yet it seems that with bitcoin it well could be the case that individuals persistently investing into bitcoin, they may well be able to build themselves a sizable bitcoin investment portfolio within half the time, or less, as compared with folks investing into traditional investment portfolios that do not include bitcoin in any kind of meaningful way.

Oh, and by the way, in regards to your assertion that many folks are going to start to get exposure to bitcoin, whether they like it (or want it) or not, but at the same time, they are likely going to be way better off to be trying to buy bitcoin directly rather than buying exposure to bitcoin through various companies that are buying bitcoin directly.

I cannot disagree with anything that you are saying since we ONLY have the benefits of hindsight after the fact, and so we cannot really know the direction of the BTC price market at the time that we get into bitcoin, even the guys who started investing in 2021, they might have tried to frontload their bitcoin investment with thoughts that the 2021 bitcoin price was going to perform similar to the 2017 bitcoin market, yet the 2021 market ended up being quite suppressed as compared with the 2017 market, yet even accounting for all of that and ongoing studying of the bitcoin market, it still can be difficult to know if the BTC price is at a fair market value or if the BTC price is being overly suppressed given perceptions of its fundamentals and the various demands upon it - including potential questions about whether people and entities are buying real bitcoin, or are some of them buying exposure to the bitcoin price, yet the third party who is custodying their bitcoin might not have even as close to as many bitcoin as they are claiming to have.

Surely bitcoin's price ends up being reflected by a variety of factors, including that there are large portions of the potential supply that does not move for many years, so sometimes there can be questions regarding the extent to which the private keys are still accessible.

By the way,  I personally tend to recommend that anyone getting into bitcoin at a price that ends up being higher in the beginning of the investment, I tend to recommend continuing to invest as the BTC price is going down (in a DCAing kind of a way) rather than to sit on their hands, and so anyone getting into bitcoin in 2021 would have had various periods in which the price would have had gone down after they had gotten in, yet of course, there were two price peaks in 2021, so surely there could have had been slightly differing price dynamics for someone getting into bitcoin towards the beginning of 2021 as compared with the person getting into bitcoin towards the end of 2021. 

Even anyone who is new to bitcoin should consider looking at the bitcoin price chart, especially if he might be considering lump sum buying and/or front loading his investment, and sure I also make an assumption that most folks should not be preoccupying themselves too much with the bitcoin rice since many folks do not have large and/or meaningful amounts of money that they can frontload/lump sum into bitcoin and the best that they can do is to be aggressive in their weekly DCA amounts while simultaneously making sure that they have enough money that they are holding back and/or putting into their emergency funds.

Another thing is that it tends to take a long time to build up a bitcoin investment, even for a person (or entity) that might have a lot of capital.  There may be attempts at lump sum and/or frontloading of their investment from the beginning, yet as you seem to be suggesting, since bitcoin is such a new asset class, neither entities nor individuals are going to necessarily feel comfortable going "all in" bitcoin from the beginning time of their investment into bitcoin, so even if they might consider that they are being somewhat aggressive, they still might hold back on their level of aggressiveness and inject value over time, whether that is regularly on a weekly basis (which tends to be good for individuals who might not have a lot of assets but have an income flow), or maybe some individuals or entities might engage in various period of lump sum investing into bitcoin and attempting to buy on dips, so even if we might have some similar justifications between individuals and entities regarding why to get into bitcoin and even how to get into bitcoin, yet their available resources will surely affect their options in regards to how to get into bitcoin...

As we many of us have rightly identified that even if MSTR/Saylor have largely been playing with larger amounts of value, they have largely been engaging in a variation of DCA buying of bitcoin for the past nearly 5 years... and by the way, many of us would have had considered that MSTR had greatly frontloaded their investment into bitcoin right from the start, since they invested something like 75% of their then available cash, so then if they had merely taken 10% to 25% of their profits from their business and invested into bitcoin, that would have had been a quite aggressive approach to bitcoin investment, yet instead MSTR chose to increase their aggressiveness in a leveraging kind of a way with both the use of various traditional kinds of financial instruments, yet at the same time, they figure out ways to structure and/or create new kinds of financial instruments to buy bitcoin with other people's money and/or to get other people to be part of their BTC building team with various levels of shared ownership in such BTC, even though largely MSTR retained ownership of the BTC rather then allowing BTC claim s to be individually own-able.

MicroStrategy (Michael Saylor) is good investor and he didn't look at the market to invest but whenever he has money and from the way he is buying BTC, it is clear that he is investing for long term. He invest both in the bear season and the bull season. Today Bitcoin hits $105,534 and he is investing means he is not investing only on the bear market.
Bitcoin will hit $110+ before the end of this year though it is a prediction.

it is already obvious that microstrategy (Michael saylor)is investing in bitcoin for long term, because his really committed on bitcoin accumulation that's why he buy both on bull market and Bear market, if only other private institutions can take this footsteps of microstrategy it will really be a big win for bitcoin, if truth be told I have never seen someone who is committed to accumulating bitcoin like Michael saylor.